My comment on the brass was related to having a few 9mm empties in my case tumbler that never got removed last time I used it. Both little cases found there way into a few 458 cases and are forever stuck at the bottom of the larger case. Almost broke my depriming pin not realizing it was in there. Inspected the remaining cases and found one more.
Learned the hard way with 45acp and 9mm as well. A lot migrated in together, and had to be picked out as the media packed and lodged them together. Live and learn!
Hoping for a quick range trip to camp tomorrow to try repeating a few loads with promise and trying two new ones with some 250 monoflexes that finally shipped after being on backorder for a long time.
29 gr lil'gun and 325 FTX seated right in the middle of the cannelure - This has shot a 2" group and a 3 1/2" group 31 gr lil'gun and 300 Rem HP seated in the middle of the cannelure - Last week this printed a 1 1/4" group
33 gr lil'gun and 250 Monoflex, seated in middle of upper relief groove 36 gr H110 - same as above
I have read that the latter 2 loads could tickle 2000 fps. Always been a fan of monolithic bullets and a lot of experience with Barnes coppers in several rifles and ML's. Reliable deer crushers and always two holes. In this caliber, due to bullets weights used, just about any soft or hollow point is going to crush a deer at any angle in my opinion. However, I have bitten into enough small pieces of lead and jacket material in my life to lean on the mono's if I wanna eat what I kill.
We shall see if I make it to the range. There is also a tractor trailer load of logs in my yard that needs cutting up now that the weather is improving and all the snow is gone.
I read that post a while back and was also impressed the the bullet performed so well. I think that this gun, being a relatively short range proposition with 200 yds being max, a faster bullet will give the ability to zero at 125 or 150 and not worry about holding low at closer distances while still being on hair or backline at the worst at 200. That was always my strategy back in the day when we used our knight disc rifles and 250 gr Barnes HP coppers. It should be about the same thing from a trajectory standpoint. We could wring 2000 fps out of those when using 150 gr Goex FFFg. Yes triple F.
General goal is getting all these bullets to shoot no worse than 2-3 inch groups at 100 and then be able to use them all if I wanted to or have to if I run out of a preferred bullet. It is always the most fun to experiment and figure out a gun and to figure out how to make almost anything you have work. In this day and age, we may have to fall back on "anything we have".
I will also keep trying, without too much urgency, to figure out the bigger 405 flat nose lead bullets.
We have only killed to about 150 yards shot to 250. After 200 our experience was it dropped like a brick. We are using 10.5” barrels so you are getting a little more velocity. Looking forward to seeing your results. I have another hunting partner that is playing with the 300 Barnes tipped. I will be very interested to see the difference in drops of these 2 bullets. Hopefully components are easier to get this summer and can do some playing.
To add to the thread, I recently bought 500 250gr monoflex blems. Not in .458, rather .452. I shoot a 450bm, and 2 smokeless mz's, so they will be right at home either way. Looking forward to the hair testing part.
So I made it to the range for an hour and shot all the aforementioned loads I wanted to try. I am noticing a pattern. I get 2 shots well inside an inch and then throw one 2" high.
325 FTX load 2 1/2" 300 Rem ( the hero load from last week) 2" with 2 touching 250 mono with 36 gr H110. 2" all vertical 250 mono with 33 gr lil'gun 7/8' - Very nice cloverleaf.
So with jacketed bullets and copper mono's, it seems like Minute of deer is easily doable at 100. I am going to continue to try and repeat several good loads. Once I get one that stands above the rest, I will take it out to 200 Yds. Looking to get the scope up a little higher and maybe replace the trigger which is challenging to squeeze well with. Got about 3 stages of grit before it breaks. That alone may shave 1/2" or more off of some of the groups where two are touching and one seems to wander.
All in all fun stuff and a "home made" gun that wants to shoot. So much fun, dickering with this gun and brand new platform to me. Projectiles are also showing up from backorder lists and I now feel like I can shoot more. Gotta fine a plinking load that shoots the lead powder coated 405 Gr FN slugg since I have a bunch. Seems like these may want a different powder than H110 or lil'gun. Maybe IMR4198 or H4198. I only have about 1/2 lb of H4198 and will not burn it due to needing it for my Sav ML. Hopefully I can score some soon. Anyone have a suggested powder for the heavier bullets?
With the 405 lead maybe 13.5-14.5 of Universal clays or 24gr of 2400. I saw these loads on a site that I can't remember at the moment but said they were mild recoiling and also not speed demons but accurate and plenty for deer. Trigger job sounds in order.
Planning on making it to the range for the 3rd weekend in a row this morning. As stated. I will be repeating some already fairly good loads at 100 yds. I superimposed my target from 2 weeks ago with the Rem 300 over the target from last week to make a 6 shot group. 4 are under 1 inch. 5 are in 1 1/4" and I threw one 2" from the cluster. Did the same thing with the 325 FTX load and similar pattern except 3 were at about 1" and the other 3 were scattered in varouis directions making a 3 1/2" group. The load that shined last week was using the 250 monoflex for the 1st time with lil'gun and H110. The lil'gun load was a beautiful clover leaf sub MOA. I loaded 6 more of these for today and I have at least 6 or so of the other two loadings. Going to really concentrate on trigger this time. I need to do (2) things. Probably replace the trigger and also find a mount that allows the scope to be a little higher
I am happy that projectiles have been acquired that should ensure plenty of testing and plinking this year and beyond. Luckily for me, other components were in healthy supplies before this last wipeout of supplies. I would like other powders to try but between the ones I have, I probably don't need others.
So I just got back from the range, started a batch of shells in the tumbler, organized all my targets and put stuff away. I did shoot all the aforementioned loads today. 6 of each. I first shot (3) 3 shot groups at different targets with each load. All acceptable but nothing amazing. I was about to go set up another target at the 200 yd line when one of my buddies showed up. Guess what he had just bought?? A Labradar!!! Wow. He insisted we set it up and see how it worked. So instead of setting up more targets at long range, I re-shot 3 more rounds into the 3 existing targets. Ended up with (3) 6 shot groups with each load. And I got some real life speeds off the Labrader.
325 FTX - 29 gr lil'gun averaged 1,712 300 Gr Rem HP - 31 gr lil'gun averaged 1,940 250 mono flex - 33 gr lil'gun averaged 2,050
This is good to know and basically all readings were slightly above my expectations after reading tons and tons of info on the .458 SOCOM link that is buried in this thread somewhere.
The 300 rem and 325 FTX made groups in the 2 1/2" range. The first 3 of the mono flex load was about 2". Last week it was just under an inch. My last 3 shots were a ragged hole. All six shots were in the initial 2" group. I do not no why there are these variances but I am inclined to think it is a combo of rough trigger, hard to line up on target cause the mounts are a little too low, all shooting done in the morning, on an empty stomach with 3-4 cups of coffee in me, wooden slightly wobbly bench.....or all of the above.
That Labradar is freakin cool. Best part is now I won't have to buy one. LOL.
So now what do I do? I have a big enough sample to know that I am at least ready for deer at normal ranges. I am thinking of loading the bullets out more so that they just fit in my 3 rd mag. That's what y friend that has one does and the only load he has ever fired out of it is the 325 FTX load I am using. There is approx a light 1/8" of copper showing bellow the cannelure. His gun is similar to mine and he shoots very consistent 1 1/2" groups.
The other thing is maybe start figuring out the cast bullets. All good fun.
So I ended up only shooting the 250 mono at 200 yds today. I was basically dead on at 100 with this load the last two weeks. Maybe a tad high...like 1/2" or so. Made a very nice 5 shot group perfect left and right, 6" low, that measures 2 1/2". Exciting. Accurate enough and flat enough for a 200 yd gun. I even recovered a slug in the dirt bank that looked picture perfect.
I also shot a new load for the 405 cast bullet. No shots made the paper but I found 3 "fresh" looking large caliber holes in the plywood target board and they looked to be about a 1" group and 2" above my paper target. The powder was 5744 at 28 gr. I added some white paper above my 3" square target centered on a 8 1/2" x 11" piece of copier paper that I was using and fired my last 3 shots that I had loaded up with this powder and fired another group. Something really great is happening or really bad, but I think great. The group was one ragged hole that looks exactly like one bullet had hit the paper sideways. The paper on our board is supper sloppy with layers and layers of other peoples targets on it so the holes sometimes make big tears and you don't see the nice crisp circles that you like to see. I am going to say that it was 3 bullets that did it since there were no other visible holes that could account for strayed rounds and the first group, off the papers, had 3 nice round holes in about an inch. I will definatley repeat that load on a nice crisp, fresh target. Maybe tape my target to a clean, firm piece of cardboard to get the holes to print nicer. I did seat the big lead bullets out a little farther than the last time. But the charge was different so can't say that was the difference.
I fired one more group with the FTX's seated really long, just barely fit the mag. This printed a so-so 2 1/2" group so no different than the loads seated to the cannelure. Same 29 gr lil'gun charge.
Having fun. I now have 80 rounds thru the gun with no malfunctions other than the 10 rd mag that gave me fits 2 weeks ago. The 3 rd mag (10 rd 223 mag) works great and that's what I would use in hunting season anyway due to the law and also it just makes the gun less bulky. 10 rounds is cool to have but for what? A charging herd of pissed off cows?
One thing I am doing that I should do more often with other guns, is keeping track of the brass. I am using all new brass right now. I have done several batches of tumbling, resize, flare and reprime of my spent cases. I am keeping them in an empty Mayo jar labeled "once fired". Once I need to start using them, I will repeat this process and have an entire batch of twice fired. Etc Etc.
I acquired 50 more new brass a few weeks ago by chance. I am stashing these. I sized, flared and primed them and put them away in a sealed jar. It will be nice knowing they are available if I need them. The 100 in use right now should give me a long time before I need to use the new ones.
Hopefully I am not boring anyone with my posts. Just like to share the experience of someone seasoned in shooting, reloading and guns in general but BRAND new to this platform and cartridge. It is growing on me for sure.
Very interested in your results. If someone is board they don’t need to read. On my to do list is work up some subsonic loads for my 458 SOCOM. I find it a very fun cartridge to shoot just not very cheap. I am currently working on a 223 target gun for the daughter and a 6.5 Creedmoor for myself. Once complete and i start shooting them I’ll be reporting the results here. I certainly enjoy this platform. I honestly don’t understand what took me so long to find out just how versatile and great these guns can shoot.
Last Edit: Apr 4, 2021 14:53:55 GMT -5 by joelmoney
I edited my post regarding the 5744 powder charge I used under the 405 cast bullet. The charge was 28 gr powder NOT 36 GR!!!. This is an an example of never just trying anything you read in a post or on line. Cartridges like this with little published data need to be taken serious. I personally look for as much published data as I can, read tons of posts by others, and then corroborate all the data to see where I want to START. I apologize for just posting that load from my "recollection" and will be more careful when I devulge something I have tried. Be safe!
Yep, I always cross check from a couple manuals and online, and then read what others are doing. Obviously most important to start low and work up to what YOUR particular gun can handle. I have 2 MGM barrels that have pressure signs near the starting load data.
Dang! Got a wedding out of town tomorrow, got a new suit, a lawn that needs its 1st mow, no new rounds loaded. Looks like no shooting this weekend after a 4 week streak. Only gonna get worse as the weather shapes up. Wood to cut, split and stack. Flowers to plant. Yard work blah blah. Might be at a stand still for a while. At least will be conserving resources. LOL.