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Post by doug136 on Oct 23, 2016 10:38:56 GMT -5
This is not a SML but same as . I just bought a (what I would call expensive ) 45/70 from C Sharps arms . I wanted the best 45/70 BLACK POWDER CARTRIDGE RIFLE I thought I could buy . I'm buying this gun to compete with . I actually talked to Jeff about building me one but when your the best your way behind . Any way I bought this gun more or less off of a gun broker so I would not have to wait . I picked the gun up last night and can send it back within 3 days of the time I picked it up . ( MONDAY ) here is my dilemma . I thought the gun came with a Badger barrel which from the research I have done is one of the best . C Sharps website said they use solely Badger barrels . ( at least the Web site I looked at ) The gun that I have has a Green Mountain barrel . I know nothing about barrels but this barrel in my opinion looks not even close to my Brux barrels .The inside of the barrel looks more like my original Savage ML2 barrel . Maybe it will not make a difference ? I could have the gun rebarrelled with a Krieger barrel if it will not shoot but dam I just spent over $4000 for this gun ! I'm pretty sick about this and not sure what to do . I bought the gun thinking it had a Badger barrel and did not find out other wise until Friday while the gun was in transit . I need advise . Maybe I'm sweating nothing ?
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Post by 12ptdroptine on Oct 23, 2016 11:33:13 GMT -5
If it aint what you thought or wanted and can Return it I would do so asap and start over. On of life's lessons I have learned is that I stopoed "settleing" for less than I really wanted. And trying to connince myself that I would be happy with less.
Just my .02
Drop
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Post by Richard on Oct 23, 2016 11:41:20 GMT -5
Did you not inquire of the seller what make barrel was on it? Or did you just assume it was a Badger? The seller might say: "I never advertised what the make of the barrel was?" Had he said it was a Badger and it turned out not to be, then you might have a better "leg to stand on?" On the other hand, he may be very forthcoming and not give you any grief?
Good luck......................."Hey, it may turn out to be a TACK DRIVER.....who knows?"
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Post by GMB54-120 on Oct 23, 2016 11:59:09 GMT -5
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Post by doug136 on Oct 23, 2016 12:23:57 GMT -5
Not any more . All of the U tube videos, forums and old Web sights showed they used Badger barrels exclusively. That was their claim to fame . I guess they lost Badger barrels due to a military contract in 2013 . This is the entire reason I was buying this gun to get a Badger Barrel . When I called C Sharps and asked the owner (John 76 years young ) if Green Mountain barrels were as good he stuttered around and said they are next best that Badger was a step above and went the extra mile . He then proceeded to tell me that the owner of Badger barrels is gonna put equipment in their facility and C Sharps is gonna start building their own barrels . I have to be honest I am soooo pissed because this is the ONLY reason I chose this gun . I have been reading about them for months . But the stuff I guess I had found on the internet was all old . I went on a current BPCR forum and just happen to come across that they no longer use Badger barrels
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Post by doug136 on Oct 23, 2016 12:26:28 GMT -5
When it says certain calibers they were talking odd calibers not 45/70 . 45/70 came standard with Badger barrels .
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Post by doug136 on Oct 23, 2016 12:28:53 GMT -5
They more or less were trying to keep it quiet . I may be screwed because like a dumb a$$ . I had to put the gun in my name to bring it home not thinking ! The gun may be fine but it is not what I thought I was getting .
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Post by GMB54-120 on Oct 23, 2016 13:35:54 GMT -5
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Post by doug136 on Oct 23, 2016 13:43:50 GMT -5
Grrrrrrrrrr!
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Post by elkman1310 on Oct 23, 2016 15:30:31 GMT -5
I only bought one GMT Barrel in 50 Caliber. I bought it to make a smokeless muzzle. The barrel was as good as any I have checked and was dead straight from one end to the other. So I am surprised that yours has tooling marks in it. That said radial tooling marks will not effect accuracy the can cause some fouling with copper and lead. If you have a 3 day return time send it back if your worried about it. But you may find that the Green Mnt barrel you have could be a real shooter. I know my 50 Cal barrel is a real shooter.
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Post by doug136 on Oct 23, 2016 15:36:09 GMT -5
That makes me feel better . I doubt I can because I had them put the gun in my name when I picked it up . If you think they make a good barrel Elkman then maybe I'll just keep it . That's kinda what I was wanting to hear some opinions on Green Mountain vrs Brux or Krieger or whatever ?
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Post by doug136 on Oct 23, 2016 15:44:46 GMT -5
Will button rifle barrels not lead as quick as cut rifling or does that have nothing to do with it . When I opened my gun up they had not 1 but 2 papers on break in procedures. I'm suppose to start out with jacketed bullets clean between every shot for 10 shots then every other shot up to 20 shots . If I'm reading correctly it's kinda filling in the bad spots . ( that really makes me suspicious !) But maybe that's normal ? I looked up Bruxs break in they say just shoot the gun ! Where is Jeff I want his opinion among anyone else ! If I don't hear from you Jeff you will be hearing from me tom ! I just don't want to bother you on a Sunday . Maybe I'm sweating nothing ? It sounds like Elkman and Richard would keep the gun and try it ?
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Post by doug136 on Oct 23, 2016 15:45:28 GMT -5
This gun will be shooting lead bullets with black powder
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Post by elkman1310 on Oct 23, 2016 17:44:12 GMT -5
I think your over thinking this thing. All barrel makers have their own way they want you do break in a barrel. If your going to shooting all lead bullets then you should get a good supply of JB lapping compound and clean your barrel with JB. The best thing you could do is reach out to the Black Powder cartridge shooters and see what they are doing. It is no different then shooting 600 or 1,000 yard matches you need to see what the top shooters are using and go from there. I have always found that these shooters will always be happy to help.
GMT barrels claims their barrels are stress relieved and air gauged and all that. They also turn them on center they don't offer any tapered barrels that to bad but that is how they keep their costs down.
Is your barrel as good as a Krieger or Brux or any other name brand the proof is in the shooting. I can bore scope ten different barrels and unless there is some real flaw that jumps out at me I can not tell you which one will shoot the smallest group. I have seen barrels that look flawless shoot terrible and I have seen some with what I call unacceptable tooling marks and they win matches. It is really a crap shoot in a way.
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Post by Richard on Oct 23, 2016 19:40:04 GMT -5
Doug.............the biggest part of the break in procedure is smoothing out the leade angle cut by the reamer. Just picture your barrel turning in the lathe and a cutter cutting across the lands.........skipping across the grove..............cutting across the land.............skipping across the grove etc.  Every time the cutting edge on the reamer leade goes across the land.....even a real sharp reamer, there is probably a little piece of metal (swarf) that stays attached to the land. The break in procedure is to remove and smooth out the leade area. After I cut a chamber, I put a fairly tight patch on jag or bore brush and apply some lapping compound and go in and "short stroke" just that little area. That will clean up that leade and polish it. Then, I shoot the barrel as normal. You will never make that barrel any smoother than after the company has lapped it..........assuming they do so. It does not hurt to also give it a good J-B scrubbing prior to shooting. |
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Post by doug136 on Oct 23, 2016 19:46:02 GMT -5
Ok thanks guys . How do you break in a barrel Richard or do you even worry about it ?
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Post by doug136 on Oct 23, 2016 19:47:08 GMT -5
I was talking about a new gun that you have not put together .
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Post by Hank on Oct 24, 2016 7:36:03 GMT -5
Sorry Doug..... I was really busy yesterday and was not able to get on the board.. So you asked for my opinion so here goes..
I really don't know a thing about C Sharps or black powder cartridges other than what little I have read about them.. so I would take my opinion lightly
First,, GM makes a ton of barrels and a ton of them are used on guns at the friendship shoots., so they must make a good product or they would not have the good reputation they have.
Second..., C Sharps makes great guns and many of them are used in shooting competitions across the county, so they must be good or people would find an alternative.
Third... If C Sharps can't get Badger barrels any more then they had to find a new manufacture and it seems as if they chose GM.. Second best to the Badger, maybe, but even so,, if that's all that is available then you have to settle for it or not have a C Sharps rifle.
Now I can't tell you to keep it or send it back, Only you can make that decision..
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Post by doug136 on Oct 24, 2016 7:59:33 GMT -5
Ok thanks guys !
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Post by sagittarius on Oct 24, 2016 22:14:23 GMT -5
Doug, have you thought about sending it back and trying to get a Shiloh Sharps rifle with a Badger barrel ?
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Every time the cutting edge on the reamer leade goes across the land.....even a real sharp reamer, there is probably a little piece of metal (swarf) that stays attached to the land. The break in procedure is to remove and smooth out the leade area. 
