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Post by henry347 on Aug 10, 2023 9:26:15 GMT -5
Looking for some tips on getting into the smokeless game. Looking to buy a CVA Scout and sending the barrel off to be converted into a smokeless setup. This seems to be the cheapest route into a smokeless setup. Starting out I would be shooting sabots and later on would get a sizing die with a press.
Looking to get away from the Blackhorn after seeing the price jump and refuse to pay that for 8oz of powder. Any tips from you fellers is much appreciated as I've never been around a smokeless setup so know nothing about them.
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Post by SURESHOT on Aug 10, 2023 10:47:00 GMT -5
jump on in, forget the sabots, purchase both the die and hand press you will not regret it, as the sabots melt you will have to clean your barrel JMO
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Post by dannoboone on Aug 10, 2023 11:20:03 GMT -5
Well, he did say "cheapest route" to getting into smokeless. Not
knowing his financial situation, I wouldn't discount using sabots.
A little bit of knowledge and a lot of patience goes a long way to
keeping out of bore trouble with saboted loads.
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Post by Richard on Aug 10, 2023 11:28:40 GMT -5
You have to crawl before you walk. Shooting sabots is like crawling. Get your feet wet first and then move on to sabbathless. It is also more forgiving for a first time shooter.
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Post by henry347 on Aug 10, 2023 12:17:50 GMT -5
It's not that I'm against going sabotless just not looking to spend $200 or more on a bench press. I see where some have good luck using the Lee hand press and the price is much more to my liking.
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Post by james72 on Aug 10, 2023 12:37:27 GMT -5
It's not that I'm against going sabotless just not looking to spend $200 or more on a bench press. I see where some have good luck using the Lee hand press and the price is much more to my liking. I also tried 40 cal bullets and blue harvester sabots. They shot ok out of my CVA Scout if you decide to go that route, but I personally get much better groups shooting 45 cal smooth size bullets. The Lee hand press is all I use for smooth sizing my bullets. There are many tried and proven loads for the Scout on this message board if you do a search. |
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Post by buckeye68 on Aug 10, 2023 13:38:31 GMT -5
I’ve shot a lot of bullets through my CVA’s and I’ve never used a sabot. I learned my lesson back in the ML2 shooting sabots. I’ll never go back using them again.
I personally would buy the die and the Lee press and never look back. You’ll end up buying it in the long run. Buy now, cry now and you’ll spend less in the long run.
Just my opinion tho…..
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Post by yoderjac on Aug 10, 2023 14:16:06 GMT -5
Looking for some tips on getting into the smokeless game. Looking to buy a CVA Scout and sending the barrel off to be converted into a smokeless setup. This seems to be the cheapest route into a smokeless setup. Starting out I would be shooting sabots and later on would get a sizing die with a press. Looking to get away from the Blackhorn after seeing the price jump and refuse to pay that for 8oz of powder. Any tips from you fellers is much appreciated as I've never been around a smokeless setup so know nothing about them. I too am fairly new. I got my first one a couple years ago. At the time, I liked the TC Encores I had at it seemed like an economical approach. Here is a thread with my journey: Smokeless Encore Since then, S&W killed the encore line. Jeff built my Smokeless Encore. He provided everything except the action and scope/rings. I scavenged my existing Encore muzzleloader for the action. By the time I got around to replacing the action on my original TC Encore, they were no longer being made, and I had to pay a premium on Gunbroker to get one. Hank provided modules with the gun. I ordered his sizing die extra. More details are in the link. I'm hooked! I'm not a target shooter, just a hunter. While I may lust, from time to time, for a bolt action, the Encore Pro Hunter does everything I need. It is a 300 yard gun. I'm shooting a 275 grain bullet at about 2500 fps which is plenty for everything I need. Had TC not gone defunct, I'd recommend this route to anyone as an entry point to smokeless. Given used Encore actions are selling for around $600 on Gunbroker, going this route would add $600 to the cost of a gun. If I were you, I'd give Jeff a call and ask about options before choosing what gun to buy for conversion. |
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Post by SURESHOT on Aug 10, 2023 15:04:18 GMT -5
Another good one to use for a conversion is JimBob here on the board very quick turn around and does fantastic work ! Gunbroker has the CVA SCOUTS V2 45/70 for around $500.00 with a muzzle brake which is a plus....shipped, or they maybe located in your area to pick up or shipped to your FFL, or you can contact Jim, ship to his location and then to your FFL, you would have to talk with JIM to start with for details. Some like the DI and or the HIS breech plugs I use the HIS. Checkout the thread CVA SCOUT Grouping good luck with your decision....
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Post by lbahunter on Aug 10, 2023 15:42:44 GMT -5
I went the opposite direction as everyone else when I had my conversion done. My objective was simple, a </= 150 yard low recoil deer killing gun. My black blue Scout is set up for the lighter sabot loads. It has the longer DI plug from Hankins. It takes most of the 45-70 chamber out. I wanted to shoot the faster powders like N110. I shoot bullets mainly from 180gr to 225gr. I tried sabotless but I prefer to shoot a saboted 40 cal 180 - 225gr bullet with N110 than a sabotless 45 cal 250 - 275gr bullet with 4198. That's the great thing about these conversions, versatility. You can set it up about any way you want it but there is limitations.
Jimbob would be a great one to do the conversion....
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Post by henry347 on Aug 10, 2023 20:24:09 GMT -5
This weekend I'll be buying the gun local, gonna be around $550 for the CVA Scout V2 in Realtree Escape Camo/Burnt Bronze. Jeff will be the one I get to do the conversion. He's about 3hrs away from me so thinking about making the drive to him if it's ok with him. I'll call him when I get the gun and set something up.
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Post by SURESHOT on Aug 11, 2023 8:18:32 GMT -5
This weekend I'll be buying the gun local, gonna be around $550 for the CVA Scout V2 in Realtree Escape Camo/Burnt Bronze. Jeff will be the one I get to do the conversion. He's about 3hrs away from me so thinking about making the drive to him if it's ok with him. I'll call him when I get the gun and set something up. Yes, that Brunt Bronze is a great pick! |
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Post by reaperhunterkuks on Aug 11, 2023 12:33:33 GMT -5
Brand new member and convert here as well. I was able to find a Scout with the cerakote finish I was looking for. As soon as I got it I sent it to Jeff. It arrived in Kentucky on Thursday and was complete and in my hands the following Thursday. Unbelievable to me. Lol.
I have done a ton of research and purchased the sizing die, new picatinny rail, and 3 piece ramrod. I will not be shooting sabots. They are one of the reasons I made the switch from black powder to smokeless. I don’t like to clean all the time. I will also be purchasing a Lee hand press, which are pretty inexpensive. For now I am mooching on my buddy’s press. Also need to get a had primer at some point but will use the press for now.
I am still looking for large magnum rifle primers. I may have to start with l just the large. Bullets I will be going with the Pittman accumax, but initially start with the fury for initial sighting.
Jump on in bud. I see this as another addiction developing for me as bowhunting did 35 years ago. Good luck.
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Post by SURESHOT on Aug 11, 2023 13:53:39 GMT -5
Brand new member and convert here as well. I was able to find a Scout with the cerakote finish I was looking for. As soon as I got it I sent it to Jeff. It arrived in Kentucky on Thursday and was complete and in my hands the following Thursday. Unbelievable to me. Lol. I have done a ton of research and purchased the sizing die, new picatinny rail, and 3 piece ramrod. I will not be shooting sabots. They are one of the reasons I made the switch from black powder to smokeless. I don’t like to clean all the time. I will also be purchasing a Lee hand press, which are pretty inexpensive. For now I am mooching on my buddy’s press. Also need to get a had primer at some point but will use the press for now. I am still looking for large magnum rifle primers. I may have to start with l just the large. Bullets I will be going with the Pittman accumax, but initially start with the fury for initial sighting. Jump on in bud. I see this as another addiction developing for me as bowhunting did 35 years ago. Good luck. Check out Outdoor limited they have Remington and CCI 250 large mag primers and Winchester large rifle which are pretty close to FEDERAL 215's |
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Post by buckeye68 on Aug 11, 2023 17:34:10 GMT -5
Brand new member and convert here as well. I was able to find a Scout with the cerakote finish I was looking for. As soon as I got it I sent it to Jeff. It arrived in Kentucky on Thursday and was complete and in my hands the following Thursday. Unbelievable to me. Lol. I have done a ton of research and purchased the sizing die, new picatinny rail, and 3 piece ramrod. I will not be shooting sabots. They are one of the reasons I made the switch from black powder to smokeless. I don’t like to clean all the time. I will also be purchasing a Lee hand press, which are pretty inexpensive. For now I am mooching on my buddy’s press. Also need to get a had primer at some point but will use the press for now. I am still looking for large magnum rifle primers. I may have to start with l just the large. Bullets I will be going with the Pittman accumax, but initially start with the fury for initial sighting. Jump on in bud. I see this as another addiction developing for me as bowhunting did 35 years ago. Good luck. I use large rifle primers in my CVA with zero issues. I have large magnums primers setting on the shelve but I’m happy with the way the large are preforming and I have no plans to change them in the future. I use the 265 Fury and the 275 Pittman’s. 275 Pittman’s is my bullet of choice over all the other I’ve tried. |
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Post by sew on Aug 11, 2023 19:02:33 GMT -5
I have some thoughts I’ll share.
1. When sabot limitations are respected, they are very reliable. I,ve shot 200SSTs to over 3,000’/sec out of a 45 with LBHS, and with accuracy. Another poster on this very thread, I think has shot over 3,100’/sec.
2. Shooting sabots out of 45s are much different than shooting 50 cal sabots.
3. Sabots will help make up for the deficiencies of a mediocre factory barrel.
4. It costs comparatively little to try sabots in a 45 before taking the plunge into bore sized shooting.
5. There’s a lot less recoil shooting a 45 with sabots than bore sized.
6. Richard has done an incredible amount of saboted and bore sized shooting in 45s. Might be good to think about what he has to say. Same with Dannoboone.
7) In a light, comparatively short range 45 rifle, I find no disadvantage shooting a saboted 40 cal bullet.
8) Hot/cold fits of the projectile (sabot/bullet vs bore sized bullet) favor saboted loads.
9) Though there may be totally temp insensitive 45 cal bore sized loads that shoot the same with 80 degree temp changes, 35-40g VV110 under a 195-225g bullet will vary no more than 50’/sec and generally <25’/sec.
10) I find very little difference in LRPs and LRMPs, esp with faster powders or DI. With >75 g of 4198(45s) or 4895 (40s) with HIS, I see a little.
11) Just some thoughts from shooting smokeless MLers for 24 years.
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