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Post by keith on Dec 22, 2015 17:12:00 GMT -5
bestill and I have talked about making some dead soft jackets for him to try with the BH209 he shoots to see if there is a difference in performance. The first time I saw annealed bullets they all looked like a lava flow, red with black spots where the oxidation chipped off when quenched. I had asked if guys tried to tumble them back to just copper and they said no. I took 15 jackets as I finished up this run of 300gn bullets and heated them up but did not quench them just to see what happened. To bad they can't stay looking like this because I love it: I threw them in a sonic cleaner with my brass cleaning solution of water/vinegar/dish soap and ran them like a cycle of rifle cases. It didn't quite get them clean enough to run into the bullet making dies: That left the Thumler's Tumbler with stainless media and my brass cleaning solution. Immaculate: I only did 15 to see if they survive the pointing die and if they fail in any way when Jeff shoots them.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 22, 2015 18:17:52 GMT -5
Cool,I hope they work out for ya'll.....
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Post by rojo23 on Dec 22, 2015 18:38:05 GMT -5
Looks good. Good luck on this project
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Post by fishhawk on Dec 23, 2015 9:36:57 GMT -5
"The Works" toilet bowl cleaner will clean them instantly. Rinse with water.
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Post by keith on Dec 23, 2015 11:09:11 GMT -5
Greg,
Good to know. Does it require a neutralizer like the acidic solution I used does? I neutralize that one with baking soda and water.
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Post by fishhawk on Dec 23, 2015 12:14:52 GMT -5
You could do that to be sure.
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Post by linebaugh on Dec 23, 2015 12:28:48 GMT -5
There is a high probability that toilet bowl cleaner is a caustic based (base not acid) product. "If" it required a neutralizer that would require something like vinegar. Just a thought.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 23, 2015 12:35:26 GMT -5
Greg, Good to know. Does it require a neutralizer like the acidic solution I used does? I neutralize that one with baking soda and water. I believe that stuff is mainly hydrochloric acid according to it's MSDS sheet...9.5%
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Post by hillbill on Dec 23, 2015 14:21:44 GMT -5
will be interesting to see what the end result is, easier to obturate I would think? maybe even easier to swage?
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Post by keith on Dec 23, 2015 15:33:53 GMT -5
will be interesting to see what the end result is, easier to obturate I would think? maybe even easier to swage? The goal is see if they obturate any better at BH209 pressure/impulse. However, if they make swaging easier I'll take it. You should see me pointing the bullets. I sort of climb m bench and step off to let me body weight do the work. Otherwise doing several hundred reps at a time gets tiresome because pointing takes effort on this big of a bullet.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 23, 2015 15:42:24 GMT -5
will be interesting to see what the end result is, easier to obturate I would think? maybe even easier to swage? The goal is see if they obturate any better at BH209 pressure/impulse. However, if they make swaging easier I'll take it. You should see me pointing the bullets. I sort of climb m bench and step off to let me body weight do the work. Otherwise doing several hundred reps at a time gets tiresome because pointing takes effort on this big of a bullet. Will you be shooting these bullets 'naked' as well??
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Post by fishhawk on Dec 23, 2015 15:48:53 GMT -5
I clened annealed copper bullets with the "Works" and rinsed with water. They still looked good long after, so who knows.
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Post by keith on Dec 23, 2015 17:52:18 GMT -5
The goal is see if they obturate any better at BH209 pressure/impulse. However, if they make swaging easier I'll take it. You should see me pointing the bullets. I sort of climb m bench and step off to let me body weight do the work. Otherwise doing several hundred reps at a time gets tiresome because pointing takes effort on this big of a bullet. Will you be shooting these bullets 'naked' as well?? bestill is shooting them so I don't know if he is going al natural or not.
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Post by jims on Dec 23, 2015 18:07:31 GMT -5
Keith: You will not need a gym membership, just keep making those bullets.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 23, 2015 18:13:45 GMT -5
Will you be shooting these bullets 'naked' as well?? bestill is shooting them so I don't know if he is going al natural or not. Well in the event anyone is may I suggest this video as some back ground buffer:
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Post by bestill458 on Dec 23, 2015 18:36:32 GMT -5
My tightest velocity spreads with Parker bullets and blackhorn has been with.060 veggie wads and initial bomb testing was same so i will continue with veggies
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Post by keith on Dec 24, 2015 10:13:20 GMT -5
Keith: You will not need a gym membership, just keep making those bullets. I started making these annealed jackets into bullets this morning. It takes half the effort. I felt so bad I had to walk 45' to the gym so I could feel Red, White, and Blue again:
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Post by flagman on Dec 24, 2015 10:51:08 GMT -5
Keith, I've shot several hundred of the Banes .458 Original Spire Point 300 grain, full form sized. They size like butter compared to other .458 bullets I've full form sized, and they have a .032 jacket. I don't know if Barnes uses a pure copper or blend or maybe annealed, but they shot very well up to 2400 fps with Blackhorn 209 powder. I think you're on to something here, don't know anout high velocity smokeless and copper fouling, but the sub guys and lower pressure load guys will love it imo, Ray
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Post by keith on Dec 24, 2015 15:29:29 GMT -5
Ray,
I am pretty sure Barnes uses pure copper not gilding metal. I know that they were pure copper when Fred Barnes designed them but not sure if Randy Brooks has carried that over but I think he did (part of why the original X bullet had to get re-worked). If that has worked for you with Barnes and if this test lot works out for Jeff I will offer it to guys like you who shoot BH209. Like I said, they swage MUCH easier than the un-annealed jacket. So far they have shot fine with BH209 for Jeff but I'm a tinkerer and this isn't my full time job so I can do it however I want; small batches of experimental bullets are too easy.
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Post by Richard on Dec 25, 2015 12:38:39 GMT -5
For what it is worth..............when I anneal the necks on my CF match cases (6mmbrx) (every fourth reloading) I quench them in CLR (calcium, lime and rust) which is probably what is being referred to as "toilet bowl cleaner?" I let them soak for about an hour then dump the CLR back into its container and rinse the cases well and then dry them. They are then tumbled in corn cob. The reason for the CLR is that it cleans all the carbon (or whatever is black inside the body and the necks) out of the interior. The cases look as clean inside as out. They are just not shiny on the outside and hence the tumbling.
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