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Post by elkman1310 on Dec 4, 2016 17:32:38 GMT -5
Well I shot 95grs today as a starting point since it shot good last Sunday and saw no pressure problems. 95 grs repeated just like last week. I then shot 96grs and then 97grs. They shot decent. I also chrony the 97 gr load it 3,000 fps with a 300gr Hornady FTX. That's really flying out if this barrel On my first test last week I said I didn't size my bullets down correctly so I ran them through the sizing die and sized them to exactly .4490 for this Shilen barrel. Well after only a few shots they loaded tighter than I like and the more I shot the worse it got. IMR 4198 simply doesn't foul like IMR 3013 that said IMR 3031 is still the powder to go to if your going to shoot heavier bullets than a 300gr and if your goal to get to 3,000fps. The recoil level was noticeable above 95grs 97 grs without a good brake would not be fun.
One thing on powder fouling Shilen uses a button rifle barrel maybe a cut rifled barrel which has a little deeper land and groove may not foul like a button rifle barrel. I think if you have a 28" or longer barrel and shoot 300 or 325gr bullets IMR 3031 Would be a real good choice. In a hunting application fouling is not a issue but a day at the range could be cut short because of powder fouling not the copper from the bullet. Probably the 300gr bullet is to light for IMR 3013 hence the powder fouling because the pressure is still to low.
My gun will handled 97grs with no problems that doesn't mean your gun or breech plug will. I couldn't see any difference on my Fed 209A primers from 90grs to 97grs Your gun might show something totally different so please be careful. Start out below 90grs if your shooting 325gr bullets and work up slowly. |
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Post by kbrezlin on Dec 4, 2016 17:45:50 GMT -5
I'm shooting 91 grains of 3031 with 325 Accumax at 2870fps. At 300 yards its consistently 2.5 inches or better, with the occasional flyer by me opening the group up to 3.5 inches. 28 inch barrel and I have shot 20 plus rounds in a range session with no difference in loading pressure. At the advice of Kyle I'm loving the 3031. Less noticeable recoil than 70 grain of 4198 with the 325 bullets
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Post by elkman1310 on Dec 4, 2016 18:27:24 GMT -5
I believe that IMR 3031 is the right powder for the 325 gr bullet. I don't think you can build enough pressure with a 300gr or lighter bullet. I can shoot IMR 4198 all day with no issues I was a little surprised that IMR didn't burn cleaner. But 95grs vs 73grs is a big difference. I do have a few 325gr bullets I may give them a try and see if the problem goes away.
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Post by nyhunter on Dec 4, 2016 19:33:13 GMT -5
Well I shot 95grs today as a starting point since it shot good last Sunday and saw no pressure problems. 95 grs repeated just like last week. I then shot 96grs and then 97grs. They shot decent. I also chrony the 97 gr load it 3,000 fps with a 300gr Hornady FTX. That's really flying out if this barrel On my first test last week I said I didn't size my bullets down correctly so I ran them through the sizing die and sized them to exactly .4490 for this Shilen barrel. Well after only a few shots they loaded tighter than I like and the more I shot the worse it got. IMR 4198 simply doesn't foul like IMR 3013 that said IMR 3031 is still the powder to go to if your going to shoot heavier bullets than a 300gr and if your goal to get to 3,000fps. The recoil level was noticeable above 95grs 97 grs without a good brake would not be fun.
One thing on powder fouling Shilen uses a button rifle barrel maybe a cut rifled barrel which has a little deeper land and groove may not foul like a button rifle barrel. I think if you have a 28" or longer barrel and shoot 300 or 325gr bullets IMR 3031 Would be a real good choice. In a hunting application fouling is not a issue but a day at the range could be cut short because of powder fouling not the copper from the bullet. Probably the 300gr bullet is to light for IMR 3013 hence the powder fouling because the pressure is still to low.
My gun will handled 97grs with no problems that doesn't mean your gun or breech plug will. I couldn't see any difference on my Fed 209A primers from 90grs to 97grs Your gun might show something totally different so please be careful. Start out below 90grs if your shooting 325gr bullets and work up slowly. Thanks for the update. Are you experiencing better accuracy or FPS with 3031 vs 4198. Why is 3031 the go to powder for heavier loads, is 4198 to fast of a powder for the heavier bullets? |
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Post by deadeye on Dec 4, 2016 19:58:19 GMT -5
I have to agree its all about efficiency,3031 with 325 gn class bullets really shines especially out of a 28" plus barrels & better @ approx. 30-31"/shorter barrel than 28" I probably would stick w/ 4198.
300gn class will be ideal w/ 4198...imo
275gn probably- n120,r7 & 4198 area depending. jmho. |
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Post by elkman1310 on Dec 4, 2016 20:01:27 GMT -5
The accuracy is really good with IMR3031 It is quite a bit slower burning then IMR 4198 or H 4198 And it will cost you more to shoot but if your after more velocity than you can safely get with 4198 then give that powder a try. 10X should work really good but I seemed to have pressure with 10X before I got to the velocity I was looking for. I might have to give that one another try some day.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 5, 2016 2:17:40 GMT -5
While 3031 is well suited for 325's, I have had excellent and very accurate results with it all the way down to the 275 Accumax at 3225 fps. According to QL, it is burning 100% of the powder in the barrel. With a .035 bushing, the primers read like a semi- hot 308 varget load. Also, the 4198 hard fouling after a few days is a thing of the past. 3031 doesn't do that.
I will say that the ignition system makes a big difference. The HIS system, with its small nose recess cavity, acts as a booster which further enhances the world class performance of the LRMP. Looks like my imr 4198 days are over.
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Post by linebaugh on Dec 5, 2016 6:35:19 GMT -5
While 3031 is well suited for 325's, I have had excellent and very accurate results with it all the way down to the 275 Accumax at 3225 fps. According to QL, it is burning 100% of the powder in the barrel. With a .035 bushing, the primers read like a semi- hot 308 varget load. Also, the 4198 hard fouling after a few days is a thing of the past. 3031 doesn't do that. I will say that the ignition system makes a big difference. The HIS system, with its small nose recess cavity, acts as a booster which further enhances the world class performance of the LRMP. Looks like my imr 4198 days are over. This is exactly what I see. In fact everything you just wrote is 100% my experience as well. I run 90-95gr of 3031 in a 24" bbl with a saboted 240gr bullet at 3050fps (40k or less?) and MLRP ignition. Pretty much does not foul at all and that hard carbon build up is gone. I have shot 120 rounds without cleaning my plug in the past and the plug came out looking excellent. I almost never clean my barrel unless it starts feeling or shooting bad. The fouling I do see is a soft grey fouling that comes off easily vs that hard carbon foul we see with 4198 that requires drill bits. I also shoot sabotless 275 and 300gr bullets in the same gun with the same 90-95gr loads without problems. My bushing has been cracked for a while and recently opened up and I can't get my sabot loads to group anymore so I am running 275gr MH to get me through the season. They still shoot under MOA easily even with the larger flame path. Perhaps the 209 ignition is not the same as MLRP when it comes to this powder? Don't know?? I do know (IMO) there is much misinformation being stated about 3031 that absolutely contradicts my personal findings. I believe I am on my 4th or 5th can of 3031 now so I have a few more data points to work from than most. YMMV. Don't condemn nor condone based on what you read but please do yourselves a favor and try some 3031 and find out for yourselves. |
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Post by hando31 on Dec 5, 2016 7:28:23 GMT -5
Happened to be in Kentucky picking up a gun with Don when Kyle and Jenna showed up a week or so ago. He was gracious enough to give me the majority of his remaining stash of the Aero 325's since he knew I was heading to Missouri end of December for MZ season for some additional field work. I'm pretty much sold on the 3031 with the 325's. I haven't bumped the powder up since 90 grains has shot lights out for me so far, smallest 100 yard group I've every shot,I may after season is over. Temperatures the day I chronographed was high 30's and magnetospeed was right at 2800 fps. I'm shooting one of Jeff's builds with a 30 inch barrell.
Got a chance to verify dope at 300 and 400 yesterday so I'm basically ready for Missouri, won't get here soon enough. It was interesting to see the difference in wind drift at 400 shooting the original Accumax and then Aeromax right after, i think Kyle has another winner in the Aeromax.
My expierrnces so far are on point with what a few have said so it looks like I'll be buying and 8 pounder of 3031 soon. 😊
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Post by speedrackin on Dec 5, 2016 7:45:29 GMT -5
Im going to have to get in to some 3031 now that i have a chrono ....BY the way Hando i had an encounter with a buck like the one in your Avtar he just wouldnt give me that broad side shot at 325 stood there facing me........i haven't slept all nite
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Post by arhuntingfool on Dec 5, 2016 16:10:46 GMT -5
While 3031 is well suited for 325's, I have had excellent and very accurate results with it all the way down to the 275 Accumax at 3225 fps. According to QL, it is burning 100% of the powder in the barrel. With a .035 bushing, the primers read like a semi- hot 308 varget load. Also, the 4198 hard fouling after a few days is a thing of the past. 3031 doesn't do that. I will say that the ignition system makes a big difference. The HIS system, with its small nose recess cavity, acts as a booster which further enhances the world class performance of the LRMP. Looks like my imr 4198 days are over. Scat, How are you modeling the 3031 in QL? I can't get the case length and cartridge length to work correctly to get the powder to 100% filling/L.R. What are you using for case length and cartridge length? |
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Post by elkman1310 on Dec 5, 2016 17:25:54 GMT -5
I can only report on how my gun is reacting to IMR3031. This breech plug has a .030 bushing probably a little bigger bushing would help make IMR 3031 burn cleaner. It simply doesn't burn that clean in my barrel. I do have a few 325grs if I get chance I will test with those.
But yes IMR 3031 is a good powder to use.
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Post by hillbill on Dec 5, 2016 21:59:05 GMT -5
I have yet to use 3031 with lighter bullets but it works very well with the 325s and long barrels, IKE is a 209 gun and I'm shooting winchester 209s, speed is 2833 with 92 grns at 48 degrees out of a 30" total length tube. with Jeff's system speeds would likely be higher or with a magnum primer they would be higher as well, some day I will set the plug up for federal 209As and see what difference it makes.
I will try some out of the Apex soon and see what it does in a shorter barrel with a 275.
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Post by hillbill on Dec 5, 2016 22:01:27 GMT -5
arhuntingfool
you must manipulate the case volume numbers until you get about 5% compression on the load, then you will be in the ballpark.
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