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Post by dennis on Aug 7, 2017 11:34:21 GMT -5
I'm sure someone has covered this before, but I am going to ask, how often do you clean your barrel shooting smooth formed? I am probably cleaning my barrel too much and therefore not getting decent/consistent groups.
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Post by hillbill on Aug 7, 2017 11:39:58 GMT -5
For me? not much, maybe twice per year or if loading gets irratic or visible sighns of copper show under bright sunlight.
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Post by dennis on Aug 7, 2017 13:37:24 GMT -5
Thanks Bill, I am sure now why I am not getting my apex to group well sabot-less. I have been able to get it to start grouping towards the end of a shooting session then cleaned it and have to go through about 10-12 shots to get it to come around to 1 1/2" groups., by then I am discouraged and call it a day. I am going to just clean my breechplug from now on and see if it doesn't tighten things up. The bullets seem to be sized good at .4495 but almost fall down the barrel on a clean barrel. They feel good after some fouling. Time will tell, I am still trying to figure this sabot-less thing out. Thanks again.
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Post by Richard on Aug 7, 2017 13:40:26 GMT -5
I shoot between 30 to 40 bullets a week so I clean every time. Not much? Maybe one wet patch in and out on both sides and the same for a dry one. I see very little if any, signs of copper with my borescope. It generally then takes 3 or 4 shots to bet back to consistent grouping and velocity. A lot will have to do with the load you are shooting?
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Post by dennis on Aug 7, 2017 14:38:27 GMT -5
I have been trying to remember what it was I did thet I got the 200FTX to shoot and all I remember is that I was making scope adjustments every 3 shots till I got on the bull and by then it was grouping under 1". I haven't benn able to get a repeat of that, but I have been cleaning the barrel completely after each time out. I'm going to leave it fouled except for the breechplug (209) for the next while and see if it doesn't come back around. I don't get out much to shoot in the summer months as I don't like the heat. I remember Hank saying at the polar bear get together that he hadn't cleaned cyclops for well over 100 shots. Probably every barrel is it's own animal when it comes to what they like. I sure appreciate all the help from everyone as I am trying to learn what most of you already know. You all have probably experienced everything I am running into and are well past it.
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Post by dennis on Aug 7, 2017 14:38:53 GMT -5
Also have tried with veggie wads wool wads, it does better without wads. Only thing I haven't tried is thinner jacketed/ costlier bullets. I may just have to eat less and get some good bullets.
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Post by buckdoehunter on Aug 7, 2017 16:14:01 GMT -5
Which ignition system are you using? If your using a LRMP, do you get much fouling in the breech plug?
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Post by dennis on Aug 7, 2017 19:29:15 GMT -5
Which ignition system are you using? If your using a LRMP, do you get much fouling in the breech plug? I'm using Hank's 209 breech-plug with .035 bushing and am not getting any leaking with win. primers, so I don't think plug fouling is the issue. I honestly believe I need to keep shooting the rifle a little more without cleaning and see if my groups improve. |
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Post by cornbread on Aug 7, 2017 19:41:32 GMT -5
My question is how often do you clean a full form gun and what process and products do you use?
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Post by hillbill on Aug 7, 2017 20:39:49 GMT -5
I use Bore Tech and a bronze brush for a few strokes, swab till clean then use Kroil on a clean brush, swab clean, lightly oil.
you can use lots of different cleaners, many here use others with good results, don't put too much into cleaning too often, as long as accuracy and loading pressure are there leave it alone!
during season? I leave it dirty but push a bullet thru the bore with the plug out after a range session, this will scrub the bore of excess fouling
and you will be ready to load and hunt.
ALWAYS HUNT ON A FOULED BORE!
I normally shoot at least 5 shots thru a clean barrel before calling it good..
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Post by dannoboone on Aug 8, 2017 10:37:00 GMT -5
If, after accuracy has been found with a certain load, fouling begins to be a problem getting bullets down the bore, a nylon bore brush has helped the situation in the past. It just depends on the powder used, your particular bore, how you hold your tongue, etc.  |
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Post by markb317 on Aug 8, 2017 11:35:50 GMT -5
I don't clean everything out unless it doesn't group well. It will usually take some shooting after cleaning for the barrel to fill any rough spots in the barrel and start grouping good again.
I will run a nylon brush or bore snake through my ml before I load it the first time if it has set for a few months to remove the buildup that forms as the residue hardens. This will make loading that first bullet go down easier.
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Post by dennis on Aug 8, 2017 11:46:31 GMT -5
After so many of the same type answers I am convinced that my problems are mostly operator error/OCD on the barrel cleaning. The army ruined me that way. Thanks to all for all your information, us newer guys would be lost without all your help.
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Post by aldeerhunter on Aug 8, 2017 13:29:55 GMT -5
How often are you cleaning the plug?
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Post by dennis on Aug 8, 2017 14:57:42 GMT -5
How often are you cleaning the plug? After each shooting session. |
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Post by aldeerhunter on Aug 9, 2017 17:24:31 GMT -5
I have found that cleaning the plug effects the point of impact.
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Post by buckdoehunter on Aug 9, 2017 18:36:53 GMT -5
I have found that cleaning the plug effects the point of impact. Me too |
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Post by dennis on Aug 9, 2017 21:12:14 GMT -5
I have found that cleaning the plug effects the point of impact. Me too I am going to pay attention to this from now on, since you mention it. Every little thing is not such a little thing with these rifles. |
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Post by buckdoehunter on Aug 10, 2017 4:38:40 GMT -5
A few things I do before loading a rifle on a clean, oiled bore
Run a dry patch down the bore, then a damp alcohol patch, then a dry patch, then I fire 3 primers to clear the breech plug and help foul the bore. Depending on the load and rifle, it can help reduce or eliminate clean bore flyers.
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Post by aldeerhunter on Aug 10, 2017 8:20:44 GMT -5
As you shoot the breech plug accumulate carbon just like the barrel. The accumulation slows down and seems to stabilize after it reaches a certain point. I would not clean the barrel or the plug until I started to see a change in accuracy or experience problems with loading. Even then I don't think going overboard with cleaning is the answer and Would run a few with patches and then dry patches through the barrel and leave the plug alone as long as I am seeing consistent groups.
For hunting purposes, my approach changes. I clean the plug and make sure I have no problems getting bullets down the barrel with the desired amount of Pressure. I then shoot 3 to 5 shots to make sure that the plug has settled in. I am more concerned with getting the gun to go bang then I am about tight groups. Still, I expect decent accuracy from my hunting load. For me decent is under one MOA.
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