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Post by Richard on Jul 17, 2017 19:36:51 GMT -5
Had not received any stuff from Fury so only some various loads with the 300 gr. XTP. BTW, I got Herman shooting these XTP’s today and he is hooked! So, sunny, hot and humid this morning but wind of little consequence. In the past I had shot and gotten some good results with 84 gr. of H-322 so I figured lets try a duplex and see what happens? I dropped the 322 back to 76 gr. and then boosted it with 5 gr. of 4759 (5/76) to see what velocity I would get, the accuracy and the ES. It did not disappoint and I am looking forward to substituting N-110 next week to see how that works out. Should be a little faster. My scope setting was from last week with a 300 AeroMax so impact was on the low side but group wise it did pretty good and ES was fairly low @17 fps. I made a 7 click scope adjustment and moved on to a 11/60 duplex of N-110 and H-4198. Last week I got super results with 10/60 but was looking to boost the velocity a bit more. Today’s results actually showed about the same velocity? Next week I think I will boost the main charge by two or three gr. and drop the N-110 back to 10 and see what happens.. Outside of the first (what I call a switch over shot –changing powders or bullets) shot, the next four went just over ½” with an “ok” ES of 22 fps. Two weeks ago I shot 71 gr. of N-120 and got around 2825 fps. This week I pushed it to 72 gr. and got an additional 25 fps more velocity with a marginal ES of 33 fps. Group wise it put five in ¾” so not too bad? Trying to draw a comparison with N-120 I next shot 73 gr. of H-4198 but it was about 50 fps or so shy at 2998 with a 36 fps ES. The first four shots went just over ½” with the fifth (for whatever reason) dropping a tad low to make it one inch. (Dadgum muzzle loaders!) That is not exactly the way I worded it………..but you get the point! So next week I will probably up that charge to around 75 or 76 gr.. For the fifth 100 yard group I went to a charge I had previously worked with and that was 84 gr. of H-322. Now mind you, when I poured the first charge down the barrel I had neglected (yes, forgot) to screw in a new “screw/primer”. That let most of the charge go on the floor and also into the “locking lug recess” which really sucks! So after some more Dadgummits and other choice words and some canned air, I got back to shooting and so am blaming the first shot out of the group on that situation………plus, the chrono did not pick up the velocity, for whatever reason? The next three shots, while somewhat vertical, measured .682” @2860 fps with a decent 18 fps ES. In preparation for a 300 yard group I fired one Accumax sighter at 100 with the 84 gr. H-322 load. At 300 I used the AeroMax with 3 ¾” of elevation over that 100 yard sighter and hit around 2”+. The first two were pretty good but shot #3 moved out to the left a bit. I then took 2 clicks of elevation out and went over to another “spot” to verify the adjustment. The two clicks should have amounted to about 1 ½”…….which it did. So I sort of figured where these two shots went……..added 1 ½” and it would have put them right in the first 3 shot group for a 3.4” five shot group. Not great but then I shot 3” last spring in Ky.? Seriously, I believe loads and bullets are capable of ½ MOA on a fairly regular basis? But, like with any other shooting discipline, they don’t always go in the same hole? Don’t matter if its Center Fire or Rim Fire rifle or Pistol, these irregularities in group will occur? We scratch our heads trying to figure out if it was US?, The charge?, The bullet?, The wind? And generally come to the conclusion it could be any or all of them? That is what makes us come back to try and improve and what makes our sport interesting……………as is any sport
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Post by nick50471 on Jul 17, 2017 21:38:25 GMT -5
I'm sure you have mentioned this in the past and others probably all know but being a new guy I've looked through a few of your threads and can't seem to find what barrel length you use. So if you please... what barrel length and ignition?
Thanks
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Post by Deleted on Jul 17, 2017 21:52:44 GMT -5
Interesting report Richard.
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Post by 12ptdroptine on Jul 18, 2017 17:14:15 GMT -5
As always Richard a good read. Thank you for all your hard work. P:S Hello to all you guys checking in from "over there" Drop
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Post by Richard on Jul 18, 2017 17:57:51 GMT -5
Nick...........Since this was a Brux that I had bulged with a double load, I had to cut about 3.5" off of it. From the breech to the crown is right at 26". Now add in the breech plug, the powder column and bullet and that is what's left. Probably only 23 inches or so? One day when its loaded and I think of it, I will take an actual measurement. Quite a few weeks back I dumped 91 gr. of H-322 in plus a 300 gr. bullet and got 3,042 fps. I don't recommend doing this and have since cut that charge back to 84 gr. but short(er) barrels will shoot pretty fast with the right load. Part of the reason I use a lot of duplex's.
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Post by nick50471 on Jul 18, 2017 20:09:37 GMT -5
Nick...........Since this was a Brux that I had bulged with a double load, I had to cut about 3.5" off of it. From the breech to the crown is right at 26". Now add in the breech plug, the powder column and bullet and that is what's left. Probably only 23 inches or so? One day when its loaded and I think of it, I will take an actual measurement. Quite a few weeks back I dumped 91 gr. of H-322 in plus a 300 gr. bullet and got 3,042 fps. I don't recommend doing this and have since cut that charge back to 84 gr. but short(er) barrels will shoot pretty fast with the right load. Part of the reason I use a lot of duplex's. Thanks. The reason i asked is because i have been shooting 80gr of H322 and a 310 full formed. The MV has been consistent at 2800fps. The barrel length is the difference for us. I'm using a Brux 28".
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Post by aldeerhunter on Jul 19, 2017 16:58:24 GMT -5
Informative report Richard.
How much time do you normally wait between shots? Do you think the temperature is adding significantly to your velocity?
I ask because I have had some primer bulging and noticed a slight increase in velocity when the temperature has been hotter while shooting 95grainsvof 3031 and 300gr XTPs. From what I gather from the primer bulging is not out of the ordinary.
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Post by doug136 on Jul 19, 2017 21:17:40 GMT -5
As always good stuff Richard .
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Post by Richard on Jul 20, 2017 9:59:03 GMT -5
Temperature and loads can effect how the primer reacts. There is no way, even with the tightest head space that you can get the entire 209 primer inside the opening in the breech plug. There is he thickness of the metal that holds the primer to the bolt along with a slight bevel on the plug...........so the primer can enter without being "crooked' or "cocked" (kind of like the leade angle in the chamber of a CF barrel)That leave a little bi of the primer "shaft" back near its rim, unsupported. The primer also needs a little space to be slid onto the bolt face which adds a little more space. So if the load is to high, there is more chance of a slight bulge? It seems everything we do with these muzzle loaders takes some tweaking on our part to find the right fit/combination. Just look where we have come since the Savage SML's came out probably 15 years ago or more? The Direct ignition system has its advantages but as a hunting rifle its not what I would use? I can't help but think that for a "general purpose" hunting rifle, the 209 makes the most sense......................when you have developed the proper combination.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 24, 2017 13:33:00 GMT -5
I didn't see it referenced but are all of these shot with DI?
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Post by Richard on Jul 24, 2017 15:08:38 GMT -5
Yes Jerry, all my shots were with the direct ignition. I usually try to indicated at the top of my sheet DIS but failed to do so; too much stuff to think about When I am shooting the 209 system you will see Clays as the booster but since the last Challenge, that has been ditched with the DIS! Somehow Aldeerhunter had posed a situation with the 209 700ML I built for him and I guess that's where the thread got side tracked.
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