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Post by hillbill on Jan 26, 2023 21:16:19 GMT -5
that’s where you lose me. If anyone is hunting long range and not supported in the rear they are very foolish. I really hope this match takes off and it will if someone uses some common sense. Its pretty easy to shoot 100yds and put 5 rounds in a single hole with a rear rest. Its also pretty easy to shoot 600yds and keep it at .3moa with a rear rest. No rear rest tests the shooter, not the rifle. Might want to text Chris. Easy to do .3 moa @ 600? not for this old man! You are way out of my league, even if I could use a vice!
In all seriousness, it would be good if some here had a way to contact Chris and talk with him. Could mean the difference in a good turn out and a hand full?
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Post by nick50471 on Jan 26, 2023 22:40:06 GMT -5
that’s where you lose me. If anyone is hunting long range and not supported in the rear they are very foolish. I really hope this match takes off and it will if someone uses some common sense. Its pretty easy to shoot 100yds and put 5 rounds in a single hole with a rear rest. Its also pretty easy to shoot 600yds and keep it at .3moa with a rear rest. No rear rest tests the shooter, not the rifle. Might want to text Chris. Thats is a very bold statement. |
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Post by joelmoney on Jan 26, 2023 23:34:11 GMT -5
Bill it sounds even in my prime I’d never been able to compete on that level.
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Post by encore50a on Jan 27, 2023 9:06:39 GMT -5
Its pretty easy to shoot 100yds and put 5 rounds in a single hole with a rear rest. Its also pretty easy to shoot 600yds and keep it at .3moa with a rear rest. No rear rest tests the shooter, not the rifle. Might want to text Chris. Thats is a very bold statement. Heck, guys are shooting .5moa in competition all day long out to 200yds at Friendship and that's with substitutes and black powder. I had to remove my Nightforce to exchange the mount and had to re-zero the rifle. Actually I zeroed with the data that you gave me for the 350gr bullets and 4895. First two rounds are top left, cold bore and one can say a single hole. The top right is a single after adjusting. 100yds. The bottom right is 5 rounds. The bottom left is also 5 rounds after another adjustment.  The Satterlee test for 4895 and the 350's..........  300gr SST and 3 pellets............. 400yds   |
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Post by hillbill on Jan 27, 2023 13:17:32 GMT -5
In competition?
You are far better shooter than I am
Keep it up Brother!
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Post by Hank on Jan 27, 2023 13:49:56 GMT -5
I've read this post, and I really don't have a dog in this fight, however, I will say this, When I set up my Kentucky Challenge, I allowed anyone to bring anything they wanted to shoot. I set no limits on equipment, weight, scopes, trigger weight, NOTHING. I said, "SHOOT WHAT YOU BRING".
If someone is wanting to start a match and they want people to attend then they need to forget about all the rules associated with other shooting disciplines and start from scratch with smokeless muzzle loaders. These rifles are not like any other rifles in the world, so pairing them with the same rules as other rifles will automatically set you up for failure. Now once you have had a few matches, then you can start making some rules to go by. We, at the Kentucky Challenge have 3 classes to shoot in, A heavy class, a hunter class and a break action class. Rest set ups are unlimited. Half if not more of my shooters have rifles that weight over 17 pounds. If I said no one can shoot a rifle heavier than 17 pounds, I would lose half my shooters. If you are wanting to start a competition you have to make it attractive to everyone, not just a small group of people that shoot like you do.
I have to say, if you are wanting to make this shoot more like a hunting situation without proper gun support, you should limit the range to 300 yards, as it would be unethical to take shots at game at longer ranges without proper support.
Excluding the DIS system is another bad decision, IMO, you need to allow people to use what they want to use. This is how the sport grows, think back to my first Kentucky Challenge, when I invited everyone to come shoot. Had I said "No 209 primers allowed" I would have only had three shooters at that first match. Now the three shooters using the HIS system kicked everyone’s butt, so the next shoot there were more shooters using the HIS system, over a short period of time we now have no one using the 209 primers any more as The HIS system has proven superior.
Let people shoot what they want, stop dictating petty rules. Open the range up to competition not a bunch of rules made for the very few. This is what’s wrong with the Friendship shoot. They have too many rules to make it appealing to the masses.
Making a 1000 yard shot with any rifle is not an easy task, doing it with out proper support and firepower is IMO just a foolish way to waist a day and a lot of money.
I do not see this shoot being very successful with it set up the way it is, So far I don’t think I’ve seen one guy on this board that is happy with the rules. That should speak loudly to the guys planning on doing this shoot.
Anyone that wants to come to a shoot and have a good time with friends that will become like family to you, come on down to the Kentucky Challenge, We only shoot 450 yards, but you can shoot what you bring, eat all you want and have a great time.
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Post by encore50a on Jan 27, 2023 16:00:05 GMT -5
I've read this post, and I really don't have a dog in this fight, however, I will say this, When I set up my Kentucky Challenge, I allowed anyone to bring anything they wanted to shoot. I set no limits on equipment, weight, scopes, trigger weight, NOTHING. I said, "SHOOT WHAT YOU BRING". If someone is wanting to start a match and they want people to attend then they need to forget about all the rules associated with other shooting disciplines and start from scratch with smokeless muzzle loaders. These rifles are not like any other rifles in the world, so pairing them with the same rules as other rifles will automatically set you up for failure. Now once you have had a few matches, then you can start making some rules to go by. We, at the Kentucky Challenge have 3 classes to shoot in, A heavy class, a hunter class and a break action class. Rest set ups are unlimited. Half if not more of my shooters have rifles that weight over 17 pounds. If I said no one can shoot a rifle heavier than 17 pounds, I would lose half my shooters. If you are wanting to start a competition you have to make it attractive to everyone, not just a small group of people that shoot like you do. I have to say, if you are wanting to make this shoot more like a hunting situation without proper gun support, you should limit the range to 300 yards, as it would be unethical to take shots at game at longer ranges without proper support. Excluding the DIS system is another bad decision, IMO, you need to allow people to use what they want to use. This is how the sport grows, think back to my first Kentucky Challenge, when I invited everyone to come shoot. Had I said "No 209 primers allowed" I would have only had three shooters at that first match. Now the three shooters using the HIS system kicked everyone’s butt, so the next shoot there were more shooters using the HIS system, over a short period of time we now have no one using the 209 primers any more as The HIS system has proven superior. Let people shoot what they want, stop dictating petty rules. Open the range up to competition not a bunch of rules made for the very few. This is what’s wrong with the Friendship shoot. They have too many rules to make it appealing to the masses. Making a 1000 yard shot with any rifle is not an easy task, doing it with out proper support and firepower is IMO just a foolish way to waist a day and a lot of money. I do not see this shoot being very successful with it set up the way it is, So far I don’t think I’ve seen one guy on this board that is happy with the rules. That should speak loudly to the guys planning on doing this shoot. Anyone that wants to come to a shoot and have a good time with friends that will become like family to you, come on down to the Kentucky Challenge, We only shoot 450 yards, but you can shoot what you bring, eat all you want and have a great time. Thanks Jeff. I really appreciate all the support. I seen the photo of the last Challenge and it appears 9 shooters? How many years has the Challenge been run? Do you have 5 or 6 new shooters each year? You guys just don't get it. Here's a chance to start something new and everyone on this site is pissing and moaning like some took their cookie. I've never seen such a group of people that if its not their way, all they do is bad mouth it. For the record................. this is the only site that this has been posted to, that has the negativity. No wonder the country is in the shape its in. Full grown adults wanting it their way or 'I'm won't be there'. Once things are finalized, if its ok, I'll post the OFFICIAL information. Those who want to participate can if they wish. |
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Post by joelmoney on Jan 27, 2023 23:56:11 GMT -5
What we probably don’t get is why enter in the competition. Most of us have nothing to prove. The reason I’d like to go back to the Kentucky Challenge is the brotherhood not to prove what kind of group I can shoot. The shooting would be for laughs and done only because I am there. The initial rules rules me out anyway. I only shoot Direct Ignition because I believe it to be the hottest and best ignition source for hunting. I also use a front and rear rest to hunt.
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Post by hillbill on Jan 30, 2023 17:18:58 GMT -5
Being a Moderator I should probably let this die but it really bugs me.
First off, I think the OP got a little ahead of himself telling us about a proposed shoot? Is it likely to happen? I have my doubts.
Proposed rules without the match even being scheduled? And then questioning those that think it doesn't sound right?
Most here are really good guys, lots have been around a long time, even long before this board.
I feel like I need to stick up for the membership.
pissing and moaning? I don't see it that way but you can call it what you want.
You are welcome to come to the spring shoot and show us these great groups you are shooting, I for one need to learn from someone with your skill set, I'm sure others could use some lessons as well.
Yes, when things get finalized with rules set then by all means let us know, I'm sure some would like to show to see what is going on, in the mean time you have an open invitation to the spring Challenge.
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Post by 12ptdroptine on Jan 30, 2023 19:42:23 GMT -5
Last time I got to visit the Kentucky Challenge. I didn’t even bring my Gun’s……But I did bring my wife to meet the Guy’s I call my Brother’s. It’s not always about “Bug Holes” for me…. I am not equipped to or talented enough to participate in your proposed match. I think there is already to much smoke and to many mirror’s for me.
Shoot straight
Shoot safe
Drop
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