|
|
Post by sew on Dec 22, 2022 12:12:43 GMT -5
During our last “gun “ season, I shot a moderately large 8-pt @ 122 yards (253 Hammer). Instantly dropped. I reloaded and went to the fallen deer. I noticed two things immediately: during the 5 minute interval, significant ground shrinkage had occured and two, he wasn’t dead! But, was paralyzed🙁. I feel terrible over a wounded deer!! I tried to do a mercy shot (the ultralite) CLICK! Went back to the blind, reseated the bullet, back to the deer, CLICK!
Removed the load, reloaded, back to deer, CLICK! 😡🥵 Drove the UTV 13 1/2 miles home, got the big 40, came back and killed the poor deer.
I have 3 40 smokeless MLers and 4 jags for them. 2 from Jeff or Kyle, a spinjag from years ago, and one from Ron Name. I had the spinjag that day with my ultralite. It is the tightest fitting but still goes down the barrel w/o any noticable drag. Back home, I very carefully measured the distance from the muzzle to the tip of the loaded bullet. Then I firmly pushed on the bullet with that flat end of the 3/8” fiberglass rod that I used for measuring (😳 it went down about 0.2”!). Using the same ramrod/spinjag I had in my blind(actually a loading rod) I reseated the bullet and measured. Yes, once again, the jag sucked the bullet off the powder about 0.2” . I tried the other 3 jags - none of them caused that. My full sized , annealed 253 Hammers are not very loose fitting. The loading rod and this jag seem to very easily go down the barrel.
The smooth sized AccuMaxes are 0.3994”, the spinjag nylon guide is 0.386”, the other 2 jags (Kyle’s or Jeff’s) are ~0.364”. I’m going to do a little surgery on my spinjag. FWIW, the slightly larger land to land distance of my big 40’s RC barrel is enough to not have pull back on even very loosely fitted bullets in it.
Pull back can occur.
|
|
|
|
Post by flattopusa on Dec 22, 2022 14:24:53 GMT -5
If you can, do as I do.....I carry a 44 Special snubby if a coup de gras is needed. Our "muzzle loading" season is actually an "Alternative Weapons" season so anything but a cartridge rifle is allowed.....or you can cut the deers throat and quickly end its misery. The info you posted on the jags is noted...interesting...Thanks! When I seat my bullet on top of the powder charge I spin the rod a bit before I separate the rod/jag from the bullet and pull the rod from the bore. I was told that many, many years ago by whom I dont even remember, but I do it anyway....maybe that will help.
|
|
|
|
Post by sew on Dec 22, 2022 16:05:54 GMT -5
TY. I always take my overpowered LCP when I bow hunt. This is legal for a CCL in Arkansas. I will , thanks.
|
|
|
|
Post by mike on Dec 22, 2022 17:32:37 GMT -5
Hope I'm not considered a cro-magnon man for suggesting this, on the occasion of walking up on a spined buck that I realized was still alive, I simply unsheathed my belt knife and poked it through the deer's ribs into its lungs. One quick thrust and the deer quickly died. Wouldn't suggest trying this on much more mobile wounded deer, but under my circumstances it quickly, with no real additional mess, took care of the issue.
|
|
|
|
Post by flattopusa on Dec 22, 2022 18:14:34 GMT -5
There was a situation I heard about recently, but has been documented many times throughout the years..... that a hunter approached a deer and thought it was dead. The hunter unsheathed his knife and just as he stuck the knife under the skin of the belly to start the field dressing process, the deer got up and ran off with his knife. Two lessons to be learned here, 1.) make sure the deer is dead, and 2.) if you dont, make sure you use a knife that means nothing to you....the loss wont hurt as much!
|
|
|
|
Post by spikes on Dec 22, 2022 19:25:10 GMT -5
During our last “gun “ season, I shot a moderately large 8-pt @ 122 yards (253 Hammer). Instantly dropped. I reloaded and went to the fallen deer. I noticed two things immediately: during the 5 minute interval, significant ground shrinkage had occured and two, he wasn’t dead! But, was paralyzed🙁. I feel terrible over a wounded deer!! I tried to do a mercy shot (the ultralite) CLICK! Went back to the blind, reseated the bullet, back to the deer, CLICK! Removed the load, reloaded, back to deer, CLICK! 😡🥵 Drove the UTV 13 1/2 miles home, got the big 40, came back and killed the poor deer. I have 3 40 smokeless MLers and 4 jags for them. 2 from Jeff or Kyle, a spinjag from years ago, and one from Ron Name. I had the spinjag that day with my ultralite. It is the tightest fitting but still goes down the barrel w/o any noticable drag. Back home, I very carefully measured the distance from the muzzle to the tip of the loaded bullet. Then I firmly pushed on the bullet with that flat end of the 3/8” fiberglass rod that I used for measuring (😳 it went down about 0.2”!). Using the same ramrod/spinjag I had in my blind(actually a loading rod) I reseated the bullet and measured. Yes, once again, the jag sucked the bullet off the powder about 0.2” . I tried the other 3 jags - none of them caused that. My full sized , annealed 253 Hammers are not very loose fitting. The loading rod and this jag seem to very easily go down the barrel. The smooth sized AccuMaxes are 0.3994”, the spinjag nylon guide is 0.386”, the other 2 jags (Kyle’s or Jeff’s) are ~0.364”. I’m going to do a little surgery on my spinjag. FWIW, the slightly larger land to land distance of my big 40’s RC barrel is enough to not have pull back on even very loosely fitted bullets in it. Pull back can occur. Always hate to see a deer suffer too. I feel for ya there. That's wild about the jag sucking the bullet off the powder like that. something I will definitely watch out for. As for finishing shots, I've done 3 different ways and none of them felt "good" to me. But they helped the deer. I used my LCP to finish a buck (head shot), used my crossbow to put another arrow into a deer (lung shot) and actually used my knife to cut a deers throat. That last one was the worst and I don't every want to do that again. |
|
|
|
Post by jims on Dec 22, 2022 20:58:52 GMT -5
On higher shoulder shots I have had deer immediately drop but not dead. At least 3 occasions. Follow up shots on 2, knife between the ribs on the other. In Ohio we are only allowed one firearm in possession when hunting so the small caliber belly guns would be an issue I think.
Good information to know, I have spin jags but never noticed a problem. I will check them more carefully.
|
|
klook
Junior Member
Posts: 85 
|
Post by klook on Dec 22, 2022 21:00:32 GMT -5
Oh boy, do I have a story. But it will not go into print in these pages. Sometimes it is brutal to be a hunter.
|
|
|
|
Post by jims on Dec 22, 2022 21:10:42 GMT -5
On higher shoulder shots I have had deer immediately drop but not dead. At least 3 occasions. Follow up shots on 2, knife between the ribs on the other. In Ohio we are only allowed one firearm in possession when hunting so the small caliber belly guns would be an issue I think.
Good information to know, I have spin jags but never noticed a problem. I will check them more carefully.
|
|
|
|
Post by billyboy on Dec 23, 2022 13:27:51 GMT -5
Back home, I very carefully measured the distance from the muzzle to the tip of the loaded bullet. Then I firmly pushed on the bullet with that flat end of the 3/8” fiberglass rod that I used for measuring (😳 it went down about 0.2”!). Using the same ramrod/spinjag I had in my blind(actually a loading rod) I reseated the bullet and measured. Yes, once again, the jag sucked the bullet off the powder about 0.2” . I tried the other 3 jags - none of them caused that. My full sized , annealed 253 Hammers are not very loose fitting. The loading rod and this jag seem to very easily go down the barrel. The smooth sized AccuMaxes are 0.3994”, the spinjag nylon guide is 0.386”, the other 2 jags (Kyle’s or Jeff’s) are ~0.364”. I’m going to do a little surgery on my spinjag. FWIW, the slightly larger land to land distance of my big 40’s RC barrel is enough to not have pull back on even very loosely fitted bullets in it. Pull back can occur. Sorry Steve, I Should have WARNED You about those Pittman Hammer Bullets being Easily "Pulled" Off the Powder Charge with the Match Hunter Spinjags  ! I would Turn my Ramrod Upside Down & use the Square End to Make sure they Stayed Put before I Modified my Jag. Still Surprised with Direct Ignition the Powder Charge Didn't Ignite??? 💥 Sorry about the Suffering Deer ☹️ |
|
|
|
Post by gd357 on Dec 23, 2022 15:06:02 GMT -5
Bummer man, that's a tough situation. Always hate to see something like that.
The good part of this is that you've identified another issue and resolved it. Tough way to figure it out though...
gd
|
|
|
|
Post by ballistic on Dec 24, 2022 8:39:59 GMT -5
During our last “gun “ season, I shot a moderately large 8-pt @ 122 yards (253 Hammer). Instantly dropped. I reloaded and went to the fallen deer. I noticed two things immediately: during the 5 minute interval, significant ground shrinkage had occured and two, he wasn’t dead! But, was paralyzed🙁. I feel terrible over a wounded deer!! I tried to do a mercy shot (the ultralite) CLICK! Went back to the blind, reseated the bullet, back to the deer, CLICK! Removed the load, reloaded, back to deer, CLICK! 😡🥵 Drove the UTV 13 1/2 miles home, got the big 40, came back and killed the poor deer. I have 3 40 smokeless MLers and 4 jags for them. 2 from Jeff or Kyle, a spinjag from years ago, and one from Ron Name. I had the spinjag that day with my ultralite. It is the tightest fitting but still goes down the barrel w/o any noticable drag. Back home, I very carefully measured the distance from the muzzle to the tip of the loaded bullet. Then I firmly pushed on the bullet with that flat end of the 3/8” fiberglass rod that I used for measuring (😳 it went down about 0.2”!). Using the same ramrod/spinjag I had in my blind(actually a loading rod) I reseated the bullet and measured. Yes, once again, the jag sucked the bullet off the powder about 0.2” . I tried the other 3 jags - none of them caused that. My full sized , annealed 253 Hammers are not very loose fitting. The loading rod and this jag seem to very easily go down the barrel. The smooth sized AccuMaxes are 0.3994”, the spinjag nylon guide is 0.386”, the other 2 jags (Kyle’s or Jeff’s) are ~0.364”. I’m going to do a little surgery on my spinjag. FWIW, the slightly larger land to land distance of my big 40’s RC barrel is enough to not have pull back on even very loosely fitted bullets in it. Pull back can occur. Sew I can feel your pain. When I beat a bullet down the barrel last year with a rock - the 3 piece collapsible ramrod was then attached (jag stuck to bullet) with the .40 cal Spinjag. Thought it was fine after separating the jag from the bullet -yes did it again by normal easy seating (this year). And it was pulling the bullet back up the bore like yours did. I have about 6 different .40 cal jags. 4 are spin jags. I have an old oversized 325 pitman so I took all the jags and tested them with a hammer (light taps) to see if they would stick. 3 of 4 Spinjag did. I used 800 grit sandpaper coned around the tip of the bullet and went to work on the jags. Took 30-45 min per jag to get them to where hammering them to the bullet didn’t stick anymore. Afterwards I used kiwi shoe polish on a Q-Tip and waxed the insides and then polished them out. I’ve also noticed (when building heavy crud with blackhorn 209) that the Spinjag drags on the sides of the bore somewhat. I machined them down .010 and the issue went away - with no accuracy loss. Sometimes things can be machined too tightly and I believe that’s the case with the Spinjag for the .40 cal. Haven’t had the same issues w the .45 jag from Spinjag. |
|
|
|
Post by hillbill on Dec 24, 2022 9:44:46 GMT -5
I too have had the same issues
I took a needle file and filed grooves very closely around the circumference of the inside of the jag, It greatly reduces the contact area that contacts the bullet and no longer sticks.
|
|
klook
Junior Member
Posts: 85
|
Post by klook on Dec 24, 2022 9:51:51 GMT -5
Great ingenuity being put on display here. I love tinkering.
|
|
! I would Turn my Ramrod Upside Down & use the Square End to Make sure they Stayed Put before I Modified my Jag. Still Surprised with Direct Ignition the Powder Charge Didn't Ignite??? 💥 Sorry about the Suffering Deer ☹️
