tdn
New Member
Posts: 35
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Post by tdn on Nov 10, 2022 11:02:22 GMT -5
This morning I took the initial two shots w/ a Hankins 45cal [Rem700, #17 Brux, Manners, HIS module (brass) etc]. Loading 73gr IMR4198 under 275gr Fury sized for the bore. The first shot had a bit of brass smearing on the casehead but nothing too unusual. The second shot had some smearing of the brass and a ridge that imprinted on the casehead, encircling the primer. It is the top one in the picture. Bolt face looks and feels normal. Anything to worry about? Thanks!
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Post by ballistic on Nov 10, 2022 14:28:32 GMT -5
1-the primer itself doesn’t appear to have signs of pressure but that’s not always the case. Odds are it isn’t pressure. 2-your modules look brand new. Often brand new are hard to close the bolt on. After shot a few times they are much easier and it normally happens with the 1st shot. The marks could be from having a somewhat hard close on the bolt. The parts (bolt body/modules) need to break in. 3-if it was hard to open the bolt -it could be a sign of pressure. Here’s a way to check before you shoot anymore. Pop out the old primer and seat a new one. If it’s really easy to seat the new one or it wants to fall out - big sign of pressure. Another check is to mic the outside dimensions of your module just above the lip where the ejector would catch. Mic the fired one vs the brand new. If it has grown in size (fired) that’s another sign of pressure. 4-the bolt head itself could be really tight and might need some minor polishing to get the rough stuff out.
My final thoughts are to only use 5 modules max and then reprime them a few times checking for the above. If the gun shoots well with no pressure issues - those marks aren’t really going to be an issue - and I wouldn’t worry about them at all. Hope the above gives you an idea of what to do. Please check and be safe.
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Post by ballistic on Nov 10, 2022 14:30:45 GMT -5
Replace the word ejector with extractor on the previous Thanks
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Post by Richard on Nov 10, 2022 15:20:33 GMT -5
Here are my thoughts....First of all, are you using the brass/nichol expensive modules from Hank? If you are, the problem is the nose of the module is too tight to fit inside the breech plug and you are having to really cam the bolt forward to push it in. This would be giving you the rotational marks on the module head as the bolt is caming/turning closed. What I have done with these modules is to "pre-fit" them to your breech plug. I do this by starting a module in the breech plug (which is out of the rifle) and squeezing it all the way in using my vise. Then, using punch which fits down thru the open end of the breech plug and just into the module, (support the breech plug upside down---but not the module) and tap the module out. You may want to do this once or twice. This will compress the nose of the module for snug but not tight fit. The other alternative, is to use the standard brass modules which do not bind. You should be able to just lightly press or tap the module fully into the breech plug. The other thought is that the headspace is too tight. You should be able to just about close the bolt on a small piece of an aluminum soda can between the bolt face and the module. I have brass shim stock in five thicknesses from .001 to .005". The soda cans are around .004" or so. .003" would be about right.
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Post by hillbill on Nov 10, 2022 17:18:18 GMT -5
Check your bushing and make sure it’s not cracked Looks like over pressure to me but I’ve been wrong before Like Richard ,if you have A/B modules they need to be form fitted to the plug, Jeff makes a bushing to install in your press and screw your plug in from the bottom You then use a shell holder in your press and bottom out your modules 4 or 5 times, it is then form fitted to your plug, same thing Richard is doing just faster and easier . If the are standard brass you definitely have an issue. I use notebook paper for my headspace gauge, it about.0035 on average which is about perfect
Upon looking at your primer it looks to be mushroomed? might be an optical illusion? If its swelled my best guess is you are getting pressure, most likely culprit would be a bushing problem, cracked or burned out?
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tdn
New Member
Posts: 35
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Post by tdn on Nov 10, 2022 22:29:21 GMT -5
Thanks for the replies gentlemen. My trying my calipers on a new module and then the questionable one pictured above show/feel a very slight swelling just about the rim. These are the regular brass ones. I will pull the plug and check the bushing in a bit. It only has 10-15 shots down the tube according tot he previous owner who is a friend. The original owner ordered it from Hank in 2018 and then passed away soon after taking delivery. So, I'll check the bushing but I believe the round count is low.
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tdn
New Member
Posts: 35
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Post by tdn on Nov 10, 2022 23:05:55 GMT -5
OK! Now we're getting somewhere. Pulled the plug and also realized I have a (what looks to me to be) unfired/new plug and bushing. The bushing retention screw on the old plug (that I shot with today) came out very easily making me wonder if it was loose. As you can see in the photo, the hole in the old one seems quite a bit larger than the new one. Thoughts? Advice?? I'll plan on installing the new plug/bushing combo and checking how the modules "chamber."
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tdn
New Member
Posts: 35
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Post by tdn on Nov 10, 2022 23:27:20 GMT -5
Before installing the new plug I took an unfired module and pressed it into the plug. As expected it was a tight fit, but once in and out once or twice it was just snug. Upon installing the new plug in the rifle and then attempting to chamber the module (that I just test fit)... it was very hard to close the bolt. Once closed, it was even harder to open. This led to some light swipe marks on the casehead from the boltface... and I can only assume (and please advise here) that the headspace is too tight and there is not quite enough room for the bolt to close easily over the module?? or this plug is slightly long?
I tested this again with one of the once fired modules from earlier and the same thing happened.
But, then I installed the older plug and test the same. It was much easier to close and open. Not as easy as I would have thought one of these guns would be...but not bad. The shot from earlier today was also quite hard to closed and open in the same way, making me wonder if both plugs have the same issue? They measured out the same on my calipers.
Any advice?
So, I installed the new bushing and set screw in the "older" plug and thinking ive got the solution for now.
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Post by buckeye68 on Nov 11, 2022 1:43:27 GMT -5
With a new plug you’ll need to resize your modules.
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Post by hillbill on Nov 11, 2022 5:02:52 GMT -5
IF he has brass modules there is no need to size them, they are soft enough to form themselves with bolt pressure but it appears he has tight headspace, tear a small piece of note book paper and put between the bolt face and module, try to close the bolt, if the headspace is too tight it will not close at all, if that's the case call me and we can discuss a fix you can do at home.
PM sent
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Post by buckeye68 on Nov 11, 2022 20:47:52 GMT -5
This morning I took the initial two shots w/ a Hankins 45cal [Rem700, #17 Brux, Manners, HIS module (brass) etc]. Loading 73gr IMR4198 under 275gr Fury sized for the bore. The first shot had a bit of brass smearing on the casehead but nothing too unusual. The second shot had some smearing of the brass and a ridge that imprinted on the casehead, encircling the primer. It is the top one in the picture. Bolt face looks and feels normal. Anything to worry about? Thanks! View AttachmentIs this a new build or has been previously shot? If it’s a new build I would call the builder. If you’ve owned this and have shot it before with no issues, I would clean the threads and reinstall the plug and try it again. It only takes a very small piece of debris to loses your headspace.
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tdn
New Member
Posts: 35
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Post by tdn on Nov 12, 2022 12:51:57 GMT -5
Thanks for all the insights here, guys!
I was able to give everything a very thorough cleaning and found some debris where the plug shoulder would seat. I also replaced the bushing with the new one. Hit the range and successfully printed a four shot, 3/4" group with 71gr I4198 and 303gr HCs aaveraging 2,700 fps. No pressure signs on the modules or primers this time and while the new modules are snug - everything functioned easily.
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Post by smokelessk on Nov 12, 2022 13:02:00 GMT -5
Thanks for all the insights here, guys! I was able to give everything a very thorough cleaning and found some debris where the plug shoulder would seat. I also replaced the bushing with the new one. Hit the range and successfully printed a four shot, 3/4" group with 71gr I4198 and 303gr HCs aaveraging 2,700 fps. No pressure signs on the modules or primers this time and while the new modules are snug - everything functioned easily. Good deal! Yup, no debris and no grease on the mating surface for the plug. It doesn't take much to alter headspace enough to cause problems. Glad you're on the right track now!
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