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Post by GMB54-120 on Sept 18, 2021 9:08:38 GMT -5
A new 40 smoker is starting to ship. When i saw it on Knights website i noticed the sizing die. 
While im skeptical of the fps claim, from what ive read it is possible to hit 2700fps with 150gr by volume of BH209 and a 225gr bullet. Toby Bridges says that is what he got in a Paramount 40cal with a PB ELR bullet. Im not sure who's bullet Knight is using but it is a 225gr also.
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Post by joelmoney on Sept 18, 2021 11:34:08 GMT -5
Interesting.
The sizing die dose look familiar. The projectile dose look a little different.
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Post by outdoors81 on Sept 23, 2021 18:43:22 GMT -5
Looks like a Fury bullet when they had aluminum tips.
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Post by iceman76 on Oct 11, 2023 7:58:11 GMT -5
I have the knight peregrine we had breech built for large magnum rifle primers custom bolt built! We run 167.2 grains by volume but weighed to equal out to167.2 running a fury match aluminum tip custom 220 grain bullet sized. For 7 pounds of force on foul bore! Getting 3145 fps. Running custom muzzle brake, it does what it says. And sub moa out past 600 yards
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horn
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Post by horn on Jan 2, 2024 23:16:51 GMT -5
I have the knight peregrine we had breech built for large magnum rifle primers custom bolt built! We run 167.2 grains by volume but weighed to equal out to167.2 running a fury match aluminum tip custom 220 grain bullet sized. For 7 pounds of force on foul bore! Getting 3145 fps. Running custom muzzle brake, it does what it says. And sub moa out past 600 yards |
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horn
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Post by horn on Jan 2, 2024 23:19:02 GMT -5
iceman who did your peregrine lrp conversion? im looking for the same. did it eliminate some fps deviations?
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Post by 240gordie on Mar 23, 2024 18:54:47 GMT -5
iceman who did your peregrine lrp conversion? im looking for the same. did it eliminate some fps deviations? I’m also interested in who built your breech plug for your peregrine? |
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Post by ballistic on Mar 27, 2024 6:49:49 GMT -5
Word of Caution:
Large doses of blackhorn 209 with bullets heavier than 250 grains will create dangerous pressures that will blow ignition systems made for smokless powders.
This is especially true with .40 cal muzzleloaders. I have seen blown HIS modules, blown direct ignition bolts and a few breech plugs blown up by shooters that pushed past 120 grains by weight.
Blackhorn can have up to 85% of the same ingredients that are used for smokless powders per SDS info.
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Post by encore50a on Mar 27, 2024 17:47:35 GMT -5
Word of Caution: Large doses of blackhorn 209 with bullets heavier than 250 grains will create dangerous pressures that will blow ignition systems made for smokless powders. This is especially true with .40 cal muzzleloaders. I have seen blown HIS modules, blown direct ignition bolts and a few breech plugs blown up by shooters that pushed past 120 grains by weight. Blackhorn can have up to 85% of the same ingredients that are used for smokless powders per SDS info. Question......................... Take for instance the Remington Ultimate Muzzleloader (RUM). Have you ever seen or handled the ignition system, such as a removed breech plug? Is that ignition system stronger than the ignition systems made for our smokeless rifles?  |
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Post by ballistic on Mar 27, 2024 19:42:11 GMT -5
Yes
I have handled several of the RUM ignition systems. They will hold up for awhile and then the breechplug will get -gas cut/enlarge the flash hole. The shortened .308 case for the primers does nothing really to seal the gases from coming backwards = gas cut the hole. Remington expressly prohibits use of blackhorn 209 with their ignition. Luke from ASG makes a conversion and Jeff can set you up with a better system - the HIS holds pressures better.
With the recommended loads from Remington with 777 and pellets the RUM system will hold up pretty well. Anything above that - convert it. If you don’t it will fail and will probably happen on a specialty hunt. When it fails you will immediately notice the smoke coming back in your eyes and your speeds will be all over the place.
Remington ultimates make great conversions to smokeless if you rebarrel to a smokeless rated .45 barrel for example. They come with bell and Carlson aluminum bedded stocks and of course the Remington action. Have done several of them with my machinists help.
They still work great as a black powder gun and doing the conversion to the ASG or HIS is highly recommended. JMO
Hope this helps.
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Post by encore50a on Mar 28, 2024 5:56:36 GMT -5
Yes I have handled several of the RUM ignition systems. They will hold up for awhile and then the breechplug will get -gas cut/enlarge the flash hole. The shortened .308 case for the primers does nothing really to seal the gases from coming backwards = gas cut the hole. Remington expressly prohibits use of blackhorn 209 with their ignition. Luke from ASG makes a conversion and Jeff can set you up with a better system - the HIS holds pressures better. With the recommended loads from Remington with 777 and pellets the RUM system will hold up pretty well. Anything above that - convert it. If you don’t it will fail and will probably happen on a specialty hunt. When it fails you will immediately notice the smoke coming back in your eyes and your speeds will be all over the place. Remington ultimates make great conversions to smokeless if you rebarrel to a smokeless rated .45 barrel for example. They come with bell and Carlson aluminum bedded stocks and of course the Remington action. Have done several of them with my machinists help. They still work great as a black powder gun and doing the conversion to the ASG or HIS is highly recommended. JMO Hope this helps. The reason I ask is, the RUM if head spaced properly, an extremely rare occurrence, will hold up to heavy charges of BH, and using 300gr bullets. Problem with it is the ignition system was never designed to shoot BH, but rather pellets. I've shot many thousands of rounds, not through a RUM but through a UF BP Xpress. I was close friends with Ken Johnston, who designed the ignition system decades back. The gas cutting isn't necessarily caused by the breech plug itself, but the piss poor head spacing caused by the primer carriers. Its impossible to have proper head space, when the primer carriers have up to a .020" difference in head thickness, which is the primary cause of gas cutting the nipple. It can be corrected and work perfectly but, its very labor intensive. That's where converting it to the newer ignition systems is beneficial. With the replacement ignition system, hundreds of the RUM's are shooting heavy charges of BH with 320gr or 350gr bullets without issue. Generally, charges of 112grs weight are used by most, with charges up to 125grs by weight and the same weight bullets. Jeff at Bestill Creations converted my UF in 2019 and I shoot very heavy charges of BH and 350gr and 400gr bullets along with shooting SML. I've had zero issues shooting hundreds of these rounds with any cutting, blow back, or module issues. Short of the OEM ignition system, I do not know of nor have I seen damages from shooting heavy charges of BH with rifles when using modules. Now, double load it and that's different. Not trying to argue at all. I just shoot an awful lot of BH in just practice and in competition, where we're shooting 1K at Camp Atterbury, and then at Friendship. BH is an outstanding propellant if used in rifles designed to shoot it, including our SML rifles. |
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Post by ballistic on Mar 28, 2024 8:08:52 GMT -5
Encore50
Are you asking a question but already know the answers on the previous post?
The Remington ultimate ignition is probably one of the worst designed systems that I’ve seen in the past decade. The breechplug doesn’t even have a tungsten bushing to protect it from the heat -not blowback. Remington wouldn’t warranty issues associated with the plug if blackhorn was used. The 209 ignition plugs with tungsten bushings are a much better design IMO.
As far as blackhorn powder use in a .50 cal -moderate loads will probably be fine. Remington prohibited its use in the ultimate -and didn’t say why.
Blackhorn 209 is also in a seperate league when compared to other black powder substitutes. Blackhorn can contain up to 85% of the same ingredients used for smokeless powders- this is a fact.
Personally I won’t use blackhorn in a black powder gun. I will use it in a smokeless rated barrel. I have seen what blackhorn can do to the best ignition systems in a 45 and .416/.408 muzzys. It can blow them up very similarly to smokless powders.
I’m glad it’s working out great for you with all of your 1000,s of rounds.
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Post by encore50a on Mar 28, 2024 10:14:49 GMT -5
Encore50 Are you asking a question but already know the answers on the previous post? The Remington ultimate ignition is probably one of the worst designed systems that I’ve seen in the past decade. The breechplug doesn’t even have a tungsten bushing to protect it from the heat -not blowback. Remington wouldn’t warranty issues associated with the plug if blackhorn was used. The 209 ignition plugs with tungsten bushings are a much better design IMO. As far as blackhorn powder use in a .50 cal -moderate loads will probably be fine. Remington prohibited its use in the ultimate -and didn’t say why. Blackhorn 209 is also in a seperate league when compared to other black powder substitutes. Blackhorn can contain up to 85% of the same ingredients used for smokeless powders- this is a fact. Personally I won’t use blackhorn in a black powder gun. I will use it in a smokeless rated barrel. I have seen what blackhorn can do to the best ignition systems in a 45 and .416/.408 muzzys. It can blow them up very similarly to smokless powders. I’m glad it’s working out great for you with all of your 1000,s of rounds. I politely asked the question. I know and understand BH and shoot it often. I have 25# in my loading room. I also understand the RUM and UF rifles extremely well. In the very beginning after Remington started replacing breech plugs, yes, they did advise to not use BH. However, that was also rescinded. Replacing breech plugs was the total reason for Remington recommending that BH not be used in the beginning. But again, the OEM system was developed decades ago by Ken Johnston and not just the past decade and its design was for utilizing pellets, which it did excellent. Neither the RUM or UF were designed to be anything more than a hunting rifle. The gas cutting was never about rather it had a tungsten bushing, it is all about the primer carrier, which I mentioned previously. Its impossible to have a brass that varies .020" in head thickness and not have leaking gas, thus gas cutting the 2 piece breech plug. Even Starline brass varies .005" in head thickness. The issue of the primer carriers and head space CAN be fixed, it just takes a lot of labor. Once fixed, the ignition system is fine but, the Arrowhead system took care of that issue. We are shooting heavy charges of BH from 50cal, 45cal and 40cal rifles with no problems to date. The 40's are sending 300gr bullets at 2,450fps. I'm utilizing 350gr bullets at 2,360fps. Western, prior to Hodgdon taking over, did extensive testing using both the RUM and UF rifles, both 50cal. Unless you double load bullets, you will not over pressure either rifle using BH209. Now......... I'm certain people have just about blown a gasket over that remark, BUT, I can assure you that I have the emails and documentation from Western indicating that. Once you get to 160grs VOLUME, the progressive burn will not burn all the propellant and sends it out the barrel. I didn't test it, Western/Ramshot did.  |
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