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Post by willies27 on Jun 1, 2020 21:40:36 GMT -5
Sideshow, Let’s talk about that Hotrod .45 Raptor of yours here. Can you Please explain in Detail how you are Pushing a 275 Grain Bullet to 2,950 Fps in a Cartridge Case that Holds about 60 Grains in Water Capacity? About 45-50 Grains of Powder Max, Compressed. You are Claiming the Same, or Even Slightly Better Performance than a .338 Lapua Magnum can Deliver with the Same Weight Bullet. You have my Curiosity peaked. I ask again, What Powder are you using, and How much of it?
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Post by deadeer on Jun 2, 2020 8:07:32 GMT -5
Not to hijack the post, but just want to add to the idea. I read his talk of the long throat, and bullet seated shallow in the case. That is exactly what I did with a 357max Encore barrel. I used a 200gr FTX, seated only .125" into the case, and healthy dose of AA1680. It was clocking at over 2350fps. This was after another guy I talked to had somebody run the numbers, and said 1680 could not build enough pressure in that case to reach anywhere near max. Using the heavy for caliber bullet, with long bearing surface, obviously worked with the slower powder.. I know of 4 other barrels built the same way.
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Post by Sideshow on Jun 2, 2020 11:37:48 GMT -5
Sideshow, Let’s talk about that Hotrod .45 Raptor of yours here. Can you Please explain in Detail how you are Pushing a 275 Grain Bullet to 2,950 Fps in a Cartridge Case that Holds about 60 Grains in Water Capacity? About 45-50 Grains of Powder Max, Compressed. You are Claiming the Same, or Even Slightly Better Performance than a .338 Lapua Magnum can Deliver with the Same Weight Bullet. You have my Curiosity peaked. I ask again, What Powder are you using, and How much of it? Willie27 i can appreciate your curiosity for my 45 Raptors preformance . BUT theres ALOT more going on with it than just dumping X powder in the case and ramming a bullet home !!! Your capacity of loading even with a "stock" book load , 460 S&W , is a bit low . What i got going on with both rifle and loading is as far apart as east is to west compared to a standard 45 Raptor !!! In MY chamber and throating, a hot , MAX standard saami loaded rounds pressure would fall right into the basement !!! Id suggest you study just "why" Roy Weatherby throated his rifles the way he did With the rounds he offered for sale for them . Smart man . EVERYTHING i have done with that rifle has Enabled MY abilities to shoot those rounds safely . I wrote what i wrote so that the Experianced Guys with cf stuff would see this and realize a little bit about me , in fact it was a drift that i shared details of . This isnt a typical practice at all outside of a wildcatters world !!! Ive given you Alot of the general details about My set up . Enough that a Very experianced handloader would Know that its do-able . I even spoke of Casuell's loads for the 454 . Which by the way ive witnessed go 1900fps with a 400gr bullet in a handgun . Im just NOT COMFORTABLE saying any more about the powder or powders ive used . A ton of important detail was overlooked or ignored or not understood . I wouldve Thought that the changes i made to the Long Action rifle and Chambering when its a short action round would have been a indication that there is something special going on here . Im Not Trying to be rude nor ugly to you . However i cant in good conscience share any more info with this . Im Trying to keep you out of harms way by witholding that info . The Entire System ive developed MATTERS !!! Im sorry but i must do this "quiet thing" for your own good . As a consolation i will offer this , carefull working up of a load consisting of a 200gr barnes xpb with a starting load of 50gr of H110 will be close to 3,000 fps in a rifle with a sutiblely long barrel of 26in to 28in or more . Iirc correctly the Rooster Ranch in Indiana sells this same load in its 460 S&W form . Thats pretty close to a 400yd deer load recipe . Ask Them . Proceed with caution even with this . Safety First . |
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Post by willies27 on Jun 2, 2020 23:53:55 GMT -5
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Post by willies27 on Jun 3, 2020 0:01:12 GMT -5
Sideshow, Let’s talk about that Hotrod .45 Raptor of yours here. Can you Please explain in Detail how you are Pushing a 275 Grain Bullet to 2,950 Fps in a Cartridge Case that Holds about 60 Grains in Water Capacity? About 45-50 Grains of Powder Max, Compressed. You are Claiming the Same, or Even Slightly Better Performance than a .338 Lapua Magnum can Deliver with the Same Weight Bullet. You have my Curiosity peaked. I ask again, What Powder are you using, and How much of it? I wrote what i wrote so that the Experianced Guys with cf stuff would see this and realize a little bit about me Mission Accomplished |
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Post by Sideshow on Jun 3, 2020 8:02:56 GMT -5
I wrote what i wrote so that the Experianced Guys with cf stuff would see this and realize a little bit about me Mission Accomplished Funny thing about texting , meanings dont always come through clearly . My mission was accomplished too . I know nothing of you or your rifle so i gave you what needed to be done first to be even begin to be able to explore a loading thats off book . Ive even gave you an example following Casuell's practices . Doing so without the powders or charges or changes has kept you safe . I even gave you a source or a starting point for a fairly stiff load with possibly room to grow by 2 maybe 3 grains for a factory chambered rifle in 460S&W/45Raptor . All things together , id hope you recognize this . I surely recognize you !!! |
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Post by willies27 on Jun 3, 2020 8:51:17 GMT -5
Funny thing about texting , meanings dont always come through clearly . My mission was accomplished too . I know nothing of you or your rifle so i gave you what needed to be done first to be even begin to be able to explore a loading thats off book . Doing so without the powders or charges or changes has kept you safe . I even gave you a source or a starting point for a fairly stiff load with room to grow by 2 maybe 3 grains for a factory chambered rifle . All things together , id hope you recognize this . I surely recognize you !!! Thank you for looking out for my best interest, and keeping me Safe. A Barn Scorcher like this .45 Raptor of yours belongs in the Hands of a Cat like you. You should Excell in this SML Stuff, I have no doubt You will be Clipping the Toe Nails of Crows at 950 Yards in no time Flat |
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Post by hillbill on Jun 5, 2020 13:07:25 GMT -5
I too am wondering how you get 2,950 with a 275 from that case? that case would have to be stretched a long way to hold 70+ grains of powder and still get a bullet in it
I would have to see proof, pictures? I'm generally not a scheptical kind of guy but this sounds a little optimistic.
Things stick in my head and I just can't turn them loose, this is just one of those times I guess.
Inquiring minds need to know.
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Post by willies27 on Jun 6, 2020 9:08:28 GMT -5
I too am wondering how you get 2,950 with a 275 from that case? that case would have to be stretched a long way to hold 70+ grains of powder and still get a bullet in it I would have to see proof, pictures? I'm generally not a scheptical kind of guy but this sounds a little optimistic. Things stick in my head and I just can't turn them loose, this is just one of those times I guess. Inquiring minds need to know. I don’t know hillbill, Maybe Ole SlyShow is trying to keep you Safe as well? He logs in and Checks this, But has no response? Not even GOOGLE Can help Dig out of this one  For Fun, Here is Nosler Data for the .338 Lapua Magnum for Reference. They Couldn’t even Get 2,950 Fps out of this Beast in their Testing, And that was with a 265 Grain Bullet, 104.5 Grains of Reloader 33, With a 106% Load Density. Now how could it be even Remotely possible to Top this Big .338 Lapua Magnum with a Little .45 Raptor that was Designed Around the AR Platform. It’s not Possible, and why i called BS on it  |
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Post by joelmoney on Jun 6, 2020 16:48:06 GMT -5
 I know Weatherby was able to gain a couple hundred FPS by long throats. Not sure how much wiggle room there would be in chamber pressure on an AR-10. Barrel length one might gain some. It might be possible but very little margin of error. |
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Post by hillbill on Jun 6, 2020 21:49:10 GMT -5
Not saying it's not possible but would like to see it for myself? I should be from Missouri I guess?  |
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Post by willies27 on Jun 6, 2020 22:07:50 GMT -5
I’m Standing Firmly with it’s not Possible. I would have to be Standing there and See it to Believe it. I have been Handloading for well over 30 Years, I have learned a Few things in that amount of time
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Post by dennis on Jun 7, 2020 7:27:08 GMT -5
Not sure if it is possible with that (cartridge) but People I tell of a sml that will shoot a 350gr bullet 3800fps look at me like I have 3 heads. Just sayin'.
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Post by willies27 on Jun 7, 2020 8:49:25 GMT -5
Not sure if it is possible with that (cartridge) but People I tell of a sml that will shoot a 350gr bullet 3800fps look at me like I have 3 heads. Just sayin'. Believe me i get that, it’s no big surprise to me. The SMLs are impressive to say the least, in fact they are Far Superior to Cartidge Guns in many Ways. They Don’t have a Cartridge case to Deal with, Which is a Major Weak link, Nor do they have Lands to Jump. The SMLs are very different Animals, They Can’t Be Closely Compared to CFs, Depending on the Exact Setup, An SML Blows them Away with Ease, Look at Hankin’s Cyclops .45 Cal pushing a 350 Grain Bullet to 3,800 Fps, The Only Thing that Compares in ft lbs of Energy is a .50 BMG To Claim of pushing a 275 Grain Bullet to 2,950 Fps out of a little .45 Raptor designed for the AR Platform, That uses a little 1.8” Cartridge Case, C’mon! Unless there is some new Fagnificent New powder on the Market that i have never heard of? And Each shot you are Risking Life & Limb, it’s just not happening Folks In all reality the Little .45 Raptor is Fairly impressive for what it is, It shows 2,300 Fps for a 300 Grain Bullet, So a 275 Grain Should Get 2,450ish Fps, Possibly 2,500 Fps MAX with a Good Tail Wind, Which goes back to my Original Post in all of this, Where i Say 2,950 Fps is about 400 or a little more Fps Faster than any Data Out there for the .45 Raptor, To try and Gain 400 Fps from a Cartridge Gun, Simply not gonna Happen, it’s absolute BS, But Please do Prove me Wrong |
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Post by deadeer on Jun 7, 2020 13:04:20 GMT -5
I am not taking sides. Would like to see it myself. Like to see innovation and things moving forward. But I think the way it's possible is in his first post. Duplex or triplexing powders. I ain't trying it in a cartridge, but do in mz.
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Post by dennis on Jun 7, 2020 13:50:29 GMT -5
50gr of W296 with a 200gr ftx in a 460 10" barrel about 2200fps. The same load in a 20" barrel 2775fps. I don't know what his barrel length is but I will not lean either way as I have been proven wrong more than once.
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Post by hillbill on Jun 8, 2020 4:03:17 GMT -5
The fact that he has not commented on this tells us what we need to know, I like to give anyone the benefit of the doubt. I would also like to see some groups shot from his new SML someone sent him, not saying it didn't happen but one way to silence us? I would like to be completely wrong about this?
What about it sideshow? (Bob)
I know he has viewed this post several times but no answer?
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Post by willies27 on Jun 8, 2020 10:06:47 GMT -5
The fact that he has not commented on this tells us what we need to know, I like to give anyone the benefit of the doubt. I would also like to see some groups shot from his new SML someone sent him, not saying it didn't happen but one way to silence us? I would like to be completely wrong about this? What about it sideshow? (Bob) I know he has viewed this post several times but no answer? It appears Slyshow has Left the Building? There will be more on that SML Soon Though, Hang tight  |
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Post by GMB54-120 on Jun 8, 2020 10:54:34 GMT -5
Anyone have Quick Load and able to play around with the numbers a bit? Such as increasing the OAL ect. I just dont see how you will get enough powder in a 1.8" case to get a 275gr bullet moving that fast. You might get close with a 200gr bullet. Just look at what a 458 B&M is doing with a 250gr with a 2.240" case. Its only right around 2900fps. It drops down quite a bit going up to a 300gr@60kpsi. That is with 77gr-78gr of 4198 too.
At this point i would have to agree with Willie. About 2400fps or a tad more is all you are going to squeeze out of it.
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