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Post by nyhunter on Dec 9, 2015 14:59:21 GMT -5
New to SML, I have been reading the threads and came across the one titled “ 4198 and cold weather”.
In that thread Jeff, Kyle and several others mention that they have shot 4198 down to -4 and several hundred shots without a problem.
Now some of the other threads guys say they are shooting a duplex loads, “10/65” as an example.
What is the reason for the duplex loads, I was always under the assumption the duplex loads were to help ignite the 4198 in cold weather.
Thanks
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Post by 12ptdroptine on Dec 9, 2015 15:18:04 GMT -5
IIRC the culprit was with older ignition systems. And the ventliner style plugs. Now the newer plugs have a larger diameter flame channel and shorter plus the new bushing instead of the ventliner. I hope I got that right . I use duplexes to accelerate the bullet at a faster rate to obturate it quicker than a single powder load. However in the past it was also used to insure ignition in cold temps
Drop
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Post by Richard on Dec 9, 2015 16:40:24 GMT -5
The thing is.............why take a chance on a "click---no bang" when the buck of a life time steps into the center of your scope?  If you have a duplex that can shoot right alongside a straight powder load then for me, hands down, I will take the duplex? Its like insurance...........you pay for years and don't use it, then one day you total out your new 1 ton GMC diesel 4X4 and BOY are you glad you got it! Also like a parachute, whey you need it, your glad you have it. A bullet that loads a bit loose on that cold morning could just be the culprit that causes that mis-fire. Some people make a big deal over having to carry two vials and "what if I need a second shot?" I would like to see a survey of how many people have to "speed" reload during ML season? You either hit the critter or you missed it in which case it generally is not standing around waiting for you to SPEED LOAD! If you did hit one and it took off, most are going to wait 1/2 hr. or so before chasing after it, so plenty of time to reload, NO? Just my thoughts |
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gar
Junior Member
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Post by gar on Dec 9, 2015 18:17:43 GMT -5
Exactly Richard. The only time I run into a problem is when I shoot at a moving deer and miss, they always seem to stop just to taunt me and I never got a second shot off anyway. Now I don't shoot at moving deer.
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Post by Kyle on Dec 9, 2015 19:10:42 GMT -5
The thing is.............why take a chance on a "click---no bang" when the buck of a life time steps into the center of your scope? If you have a duplex that can shoot right alongside a straight powder load then for me, hands down, I will take the duplex? Its like insurance...........you pay for years and don't use it, then one day you total out your new 1 ton GMC diesel 4X4 and BOY are you glad you got it! Also like a parachute, whey you need it, your glad you have it. A bullet that loads a bit loose on that cold morning could just be the culprit that causes that mis-fire. Some people make a big deal over having to carry two vials and "what if I need a second shot?" I would like to see a survey of how many people have to "speed" reload during ML season? You either hit the critter or you missed it in which case it generally is not standing around waiting for you to SPEED LOAD! If you did hit one and it took off, most are going to wait 1/2 hr. or so before chasing after it, so plenty of time to reload, NO? Just my thoughts Richard brings up a good point. It is good insurance, doesn't take much extra time to load. I have never had a hang fire or misfire with my Hankins Rifle with HIS system and have shot in low and high temps alike. I say choose whichever charging method that you have confidence in. They are both proven and both have their place. Maybe try an accuracy test with both methods. I've never shot a duplex in my gun for the record. But I'm not saying that I never will either. |
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Post by schunter on Dec 9, 2015 19:13:09 GMT -5
Like Richard said the duplex is cheap insurance. I have shot 2 deer with a duplex this year and my vials are secured together with rubber bands and it only takes a couple seconds to load 2 vials vs 1. I have never shot a single powder load in my gun.
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Post by schunter on Dec 9, 2015 19:30:09 GMT -5
The thing is.............why take a chance on a "click---no bang" when the buck of a life time steps into the center of your scope? If you have a duplex that can shoot right alongside a straight powder load then for me, hands down, I will take the duplex? Its like insurance...........you pay for years and don't use it, then one day you total out your new 1 ton GMC diesel 4X4 and BOY are you glad you got it! Also like a parachute, whey you need it, your glad you have it. A bullet that loads a bit loose on that cold morning could just be the culprit that causes that mis-fire. Some people make a big deal over having to carry two vials and "what if I need a second shot?" I would like to see a survey of how many people have to "speed" reload during ML season? You either hit the critter or you missed it in which case it generally is not standing around waiting for you to SPEED LOAD! If you did hit one and it took off, most are going to wait 1/2 hr. or so before chasing after it, so plenty of time to reload, NO? Just my thoughts Richard brings up a good point. It is good insurance, doesn't take much extra time to load. I have never had a hang fire or misfire with my Hankins Rifle with HIS system and have shot in low and high temps alike. I say choose whichever charging method that you have confidence in. They are both proven and both have their place. Maybe try an accuracy test with both methods. I've never shot a duplex in my gun for the record. But I'm not saying that I never will either. I think Kyle makes a good point using the HIS system which I am not using. Jeff has shown in many test that a duplex is not needed with the HIS system. |
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Post by nyhunter on Dec 9, 2015 19:42:17 GMT -5
The thing is.............why take a chance on a "click---no bang" when the buck of a life time steps into the center of your scope? If you have a duplex that can shoot right alongside a straight powder load then for me, hands down, I will take the duplex? Its like insurance...........you pay for years and don't use it, then one day you total out your new 1 ton GMC diesel 4X4 and BOY are you glad you got it! Also like a parachute, whey you need it, your glad you have it. A bullet that loads a bit loose on that cold morning could just be the culprit that causes that mis-fire. Some people make a big deal over having to carry two vials and "what if I need a second shot?" I would like to see a survey of how many people have to "speed" reload during ML season? You either hit the critter or you missed it in which case it generally is not standing around waiting for you to SPEED LOAD! If you did hit one and it took off, most are going to wait 1/2 hr. or so before chasing after it, so plenty of time to reload, NO? Just my thoughts Richard, Thanks, your 100% right my concern is that the shot go's off every time. I do hunt in the Midwest a lot and there is always the chance of a buck of a lifetime stepping out. The primary reason I am looking to go smokeless is to extend my range and make an accurate ethical shot. My current Encore 50cal with a Bergara barrel will hold 2" at 200 yards pushing a 200grn bullet 2100fps. I have spoke to Jeff about installing the HIS - BP on a 45/70 Bergara, hoping with the right load to reach out to 400yrd's, I hunt bean fields quite often when I am out west. Thanks for the advice. |
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Post by nyhunter on Dec 9, 2015 19:48:50 GMT -5
The thing is.............why take a chance on a "click---no bang" when the buck of a life time steps into the center of your scope? If you have a duplex that can shoot right alongside a straight powder load then for me, hands down, I will take the duplex? Its like insurance...........you pay for years and don't use it, then one day you total out your new 1 ton GMC diesel 4X4 and BOY are you glad you got it! Also like a parachute, whey you need it, your glad you have it. A bullet that loads a bit loose on that cold morning could just be the culprit that causes that mis-fire. Some people make a big deal over having to carry two vials and "what if I need a second shot?" I would like to see a survey of how many people have to "speed" reload during ML season? You either hit the critter or you missed it in which case it generally is not standing around waiting for you to SPEED LOAD! If you did hit one and it took off, most are going to wait 1/2 hr. or so before chasing after it, so plenty of time to reload, NO? Just my thoughts Richard brings up a good point. It is good insurance, doesn't take much extra time to load. I have never had a hang fire or misfire with my Hankins Rifle with HIS system and have shot in low and high temps alike. I say choose whichever charging method that you have confidence in. They are both proven and both have their place. Maybe try an accuracy test with both methods. I've never shot a duplex in my gun for the record. But I'm not saying that I never will either. Kyle, Thanks for the advise, once I have the 45/70 done I will certainly work on an accurate load. |
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Post by nyhunter on Dec 9, 2015 19:50:45 GMT -5
Like Richard said the duplex is cheap insurance. I have shot 2 deer with a duplex this year and my vials are secured together with rubber bands and it only takes a couple seconds to load 2 vials vs 1. I have never shot a single powder load in my gun. Thanks, good idea |
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Post by nyhunter on Dec 9, 2015 19:52:30 GMT -5
Thanks for the help guys
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Post by Richard on Dec 9, 2015 22:01:19 GMT -5
Where in NY?............I hunted Steuben County for about 15 years just outside of Corning (Addison).
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If you have a duplex that can shoot right alongside a straight powder load then for me, hands down, I will take the duplex? Its like insurance...........you pay for years and don't use it, then one day you total out your new 1 ton GMC diesel 4X4 and BOY are you glad you got it! Also like a parachute, whey you need it, your glad you have it. A bullet that loads a bit loose on that cold morning could just be the culprit that causes that mis-fire. Some people make a big deal over having to carry two vials and "what if I need a second shot?" I would like to see a survey of how many people have to "speed" reload during ML season? You either hit the critter or you missed it in which case it generally is not standing around waiting for you to SPEED LOAD! If you did hit one and it took off, most are going to wait 1/2 hr. or so before chasing after it, so plenty of time to reload, NO?
