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Post by jayb454 on Oct 22, 2015 4:14:01 GMT -5
OK I am new to this stuff doing this message board thing .But Mr. Hankin's invited me here so here it goes has anyone besides me ever had trouble shooting sabot less bullets out of there besides me ? I have this conversion hank made me I love the gun its a T C Encore 45/70 barrel factory maybe that is what is wrong lol.Hank did a great job his work is excellent no gripe there at all.But I have tried shooting bullets without sabots and they all fly catiewampus , they all strike my target sideways on my 50yrd target I have not shot any Parker b&e bullets yet they may work but I have seen Hank shoot others and not had that problem so is it because its an T C barrel ? When I shoot sabots it shoots fine but its hard to find 45cal sabots now days .So does anybody have any suggestions they will all be appreciated
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gar
Junior Member
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Post by gar on Oct 22, 2015 4:49:17 GMT -5
It is all about precise fit. Solid coppers can be hard to shoot well, smooth formed. I have shot Hornady Ftx smooth and unless sized real good some have tumbled on me. When you try the Parker's you will see them shoot fine. Do you have a swager die for sizing? To stop the bullets from tumbling you will most likely need a tighter fit to your bore. Good luck with it, more should chime in.
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beans
Full Member
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Post by beans on Oct 22, 2015 4:59:09 GMT -5
Silly question but....are you using .458 bullets in that barrel? If you are finding a way to drop ,451 bullets down the barrel, this could be your problem. However, something that loose should make ignition very tough unless you are using some sort of tight wad.
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Post by hunter on Oct 22, 2015 5:46:15 GMT -5
Are you using a wad under the bullet?
When I started shooting sabotless I started with using wads and had gun sighted in and all was well.
Next range trip I forgot the wads so I tried without them, bullets sized the same and bullets were all
over the place and hitting target oblong.
Next trip took the wads and everything went back to normal.
If you try the wads and that stops the bullets from hitting oblong, I would say that those particular
bullets need sized differently or possibly a hotter powder charge.
I am still a rookie at this but this is my thoughts
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Post by bestill458 on Oct 22, 2015 6:48:03 GMT -5
Shoot the ballistic extreme smooth form
Only time ive had tumbling bullets was with fullform with reduced loads.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Oct 22, 2015 7:49:25 GMT -5
What load and what bullet are you shooting...? You just might need to up the charge some....Or mentioned by others
using a wad under the bullet....
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Post by Richard on Oct 22, 2015 9:20:43 GMT -5
As of yet, you have not responded on the bullets your are using. Everything posted above is important. The bullets do not have to be super tight but you should be able to feel going down the bore. Some barrels, and I had a Pac-Nor that had this situation, are looser at the breech than the muzzle. So what happens is you start the bullet going down and it feels firm.............then as it nears your powder charge it gets looser. If it is too loose you can get NO ignition and/or terrible accuracy of NO accuracy? When you are shooting with sabots, the skirt on the sabot expands on ignition and flares out to seal the bore........this does not happen when going sabot less. You need the proper fit and the right powder or powder combination (i.e. duplexing) to get the pressure to rise initially to expand or "fatten up" the bullet to seal the bore.
BTW, there are a lot of Harvester 40/45 sabots available. I don't know where you have been looking but lots of guys are shooting them. Mid South usually always has them along with Mid Way and others. Luke at Arrowhead Sporting Goods always lists them.
Try a light duplex and see what happens. Use 5 gr. of Red Dot or Hodgedon Clays (down the bore first) and then add 55 gr. of either Hodgedon or IMR 4198 on top of it along with a .460 diameter by either .030 or .060 thick "veggie" wad and then your bullet. I have found it critical to use the duplex expecially with solid coppers like the Barnes. The Parkers have a thinner/softer jacket and will expand or swell more easily than bullets like the Hornady's or Barnes.
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Post by bestill458 on Oct 22, 2015 9:58:21 GMT -5
Imo new to sml and dont know what bullet is even flying sideways. Maybe a little early to jump into duplexing.
Maybe better to cut your teeth on conservative load of 4198 and smooth form ballistic extreme.
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Post by Richard on Oct 22, 2015 14:49:40 GMT -5
Really just laying out some options ahead of time and giving him some possible fixes to try.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Oct 22, 2015 16:51:22 GMT -5
jayb454,
Just listen to these guys and read up extensively. It will all come together for you, I'm sure of it.
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Post by jayb454 on Oct 22, 2015 22:28:52 GMT -5
thanks guys I was shooting 250gr hornady .452 but it took a jackhammer to get it to load. I had some 451dia 230gr golden saber that went down they felt about right but neither shot worth a crap I am using 55gr IMR4198 never thought of duplex load I may try it later I want to get some B&e's and try them Hank said be careful going over 55grs because its a break action T C .Anyway it is shooting sabots good and season is close and need some meat lol.All help is appreciated thank ualll
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Post by bestill458 on Oct 22, 2015 22:36:17 GMT -5
Do you have a adjustable bullet sizing die? If not you need one on your Christmas list
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