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Post by joelmoney on Mar 13, 2017 21:35:51 GMT -5
I want to have a rifle made that uses Accuracy International magazines and have it narrowed down to 2 cartridge options 6.5x284 Norma or a 300 Win mag. I know I loose seating depth by using a short action. Not sure how well it would feed from a 308 mag though. 300 Win mag I am not sure I need the recoil. I have a 338 RUM that I like for long range hunting " more recoil than I want from a target gun". My other concern is a 6.5 good caliber for long range deer. My two rifles I trust for deer are 338Rum bolt and my 35Whelen pump. I am on the fence about 7Rem mag. I have lost every deer shot with a 243 two ran into other hunters and I was not going to argue. Multiple day track jobs on the rest without having an animal to put a tag on and that dose not set well with me. I was told it was due to projectiles used. So you might see my reservations on a 6.5.
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Post by Richard on Mar 13, 2017 22:13:52 GMT -5
You can really open up a can of worms here! With all the cartridges you mentioned, the right bullet and proper shot placement will work with all of them! When I went to Saskatchewan a few years ago with three other buddies, we took two .243's and two .308's. We shot five bucks..........ALL one shot kills and the two biggest bucks were shot with the .243's! Every one of those cartridges are capable on one shot kills at reasonable distances with proper shot placement!
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Post by joelmoney on Mar 13, 2017 23:19:33 GMT -5
I have seen 243wins work I just haven't pulled the trigger on ones that have. The 243Win I have no faith in is a custom 14" barrel XP-100r that shoots sub moa when I do my part. The 35Rem factory pistol just like it has never failed. I plan to give the 243 one last try before before getting it rebarreled.
I hope that helps to understand the can of worms I'm fighting in my head. If the question were easy I would not have asked.
Looking at a Surgeon action and bottom metal. The rifle will wear some sort of a gilled break and a McMillen stock.
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Post by Richard on Mar 14, 2017 14:20:53 GMT -5
So your an XP-100 guy? Me too! I have one "stock" .223 XP that I had bought for converting a bunch of years ago and never got around to it. But, my very first one I bought (before I started doing my own chambering and fitting) was a 7/08 with a 15" Hart fluted barrel with brake in what I believe is a Bishop custom wood thumb hole stock. I took an antelope in Montana with it at 156 yards. My other two XP's have McMillan rear grip stocks. One I barreled in 6mmBR.......15" Shilen 1-14 with brake and the other is a .223 Ackley with a Lilja 15" barrel. I also have a Contender in 7.62 by 39 with 15" Hart barrel and it took another antelope in Montana at 220 yards. Both goats were one shot kills. I also took a 150 yard mule deer with the Contender. Lots of ground hogs and prairie dogs with the XP's screencast
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Post by joelmoney on Mar 14, 2017 15:17:11 GMT -5
Got started in xp's because I wanted to extend my effective range in MN slug zones. Still looking at legal ways of doing that still. I have been wanting a Swinglock since he chamered his first 416. I just have not been able to justify the price to myself. Then I saw a Richard someone or another shooting groundhogs with a smokeless muzzleloader. Bought some videos from him on making one. I then injured myself taking myself out of the workforce. Well getting closer to being able to afford a couple new toys one is a smokeless muzzleloader the other is a rifle to shoot long range steel and a long range hunter.
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Post by linebaugh on Mar 14, 2017 18:03:33 GMT -5
I am going to hate myself for responding when 10 other opinions pop up right after I reply. Nothing wrong with a .243 and I suspect you probably had poor shot placement or a poor bullet design or both. I personally consider the .243 to be a mini-magnum. Given realistic expectations I can't imagine a deer surviving a .243 through the lungs for long. I have taken antelope with a .243 in Wyoming 3x on the same trip with my 70gr b-tip coyote loads.
The 6.5-284 uses a lot of extra powder for very little return over some of the other true short action rounds. It's also one of the "tweener" cartridges that sits between a short action and long action and IMO you would be far better off running that round in a long action. By deep seating bullets to make it work in a short action you lose case capacity and also hinder accuracy potential by seating below the case neck. For the above reasons I would opt for a .260 AI or straight .260. Even a 6.5x47 or 6.5 Creed will push velocity within 100-150fps and use 10+ grains less powder to get there. Dialing in one extra MOA is not that big of a deal. By sticking with .260 or 6.5x47 you have excellent Lapua brass to work with also. I am presently considering the .260AI or 6.5x47 for an ultralight build for the above reasons plus minimal recoil.
I have never had any fascination with .300 magnums because the 7mm will either ballistically duplicate it or better it in most every case. If you are willing to eat the recoil and shoot the heavies (220-240gr) then you have a pretty formidibale deer/tactical round in the 300 mag. Even then a 7mm mag with 180-195 bullets will best it ballistically. Here again you are using 5-10gr less powder also.
If it were me I would either go back to 6mm or 6.5mm on a short action. 6 Dasher, 6XC, 6-6.5x47, or .243 Winchester shooting the heavies 105-115 full tilt boogie. Or 6.5x47, .260 or .260AI again shooting the heavies 130-142 full tilt boogie.
Since you are going custom you can get the twist and length you want to best optimize the use of the smaller case capacity. Add a brake to the smaller rounds and good glass and you will be able to watch your bullet flight under the right conditions. There is nothing more important than being able to see impacts or bullet flight in long range tactical which carries over directly to hunting.
You asked. My .02$
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Post by joelmoney on Mar 14, 2017 22:41:16 GMT -5
Linebough thanks for the reply. Any insight is more than welcome. I seem to learn more from those I disagree with than those who agree.
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Post by markb317 on Mar 16, 2017 5:51:52 GMT -5
I would go with a 7mm SAUM, very good bullet selection and very good accuracy. You should be able to take deer at long ranges with no problem. I had a 6.5X284 and it was one of the most accurate guns I had. It shot 140 Bergers Hybrids at 3160 ft/sec.from a 28" barrel and had very little wind drift.
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Post by deadeye on Mar 16, 2017 8:13:20 GMT -5
they all work but its hard ballistically to beat a 7mm's & 6.5's performance.
my personal favorite for long work a 7mm w/ 168gn accubond LR or 300 rum with 190gn accubond LR//long actions of course.
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Post by Richard on Mar 16, 2017 15:55:22 GMT -5
When it gets right down to it, most all these "newer" cartridges that have came out in the last 10 years or so (the various WSM's and RUM's etc) do not drastically improve on the older stuff like the .308, .243, 30/06, 7mmMag and 300WinMag. They are basically the gun/ammunition companies tempting you buy the "latest/greatest" cartridge? Same goes for new cars, computers, phones..........you name it! I guess it is what keeps our economy going!
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Post by aldeerhunter on Mar 17, 2017 9:32:36 GMT -5
Recoil is going to be affected by several variables. I have never shot a 7mm that I thought had less recoil than my 300 mag. You don't see much discussion about it but 140 to 150 grain bullets work great for deer sized game in 300 mags and the recoil is hardly noticeable in the two rifles that I have.
Bullet selection and placement is more important with a .243. My sons and I have hunted with one for years and only lost one deer.
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Post by elkman1310 on Mar 17, 2017 10:21:48 GMT -5
Well here is my two cents I am a 6.5/284 believer for long range varmints and target shooting even with the Berger 140 at 2950fps it is not anywhere near at the top of my list for long range hunting beyond 500 yards. I know they shot elk at 900 yards on TV but that is not real world long range hunting when you have to hunt in poor conditions. Also a 6.5/284 doesn't feed through a short action unless you seat the bullets really deep so that's out. 260AL is a nice cartridge but strictly a hand loaders option. 260 Rem is a nice 300 yard and under deer rifle and best suited for a short action.
A high velocity 6mm cartridge will do a good job if you keep your shots at a realistic range and make sure your shot placement is good. I have killed a lot of deer with a .270win great gun but the 7mm mag is better that is my main caliber I hunt with when it comes to a carry rifle. My long range rifles are .338 with 300grs bullets there is no substitute for a heavy bullet with a high BC when your talking about 1k and well beyond 30cal guns just don't cut it beyond 1,200 yards been there and done it with to many disappointments the long range hunting game is ruled by the .338 and .375 then .408 and last the big .50Cal the .338 and .375 have the best hunt bullets made to date
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Post by kbrezlin on Mar 18, 2017 16:00:44 GMT -5
Im going to build a custom 300 Win Mag this year. 2 thoughts for choosing it by me. 1. It is proven and has been around for over 50 years doing everything I would ever need out to 600 yards and more. 2. If you get in a jam pretty much every place you go you will be able to find 300 win mag ammo, along with 7mm Rem Mag, 308 and 30-06 and probably a few others I can't think of right now.
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tcas
New Member
Posts: 33
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Post by tcas on Mar 24, 2017 18:25:03 GMT -5
I want to have a rifle made that uses Accuracy International magazines and have it narrowed down to 2 cartridge options 6.5x284 Norma or a 300 Win mag. ...................................................................................Well I use the Accurate Mag's in just about any AICS Bottom Metal , Accurate mags always seem to feed better and support slightly longer OAL. As for Caliber, I've hunted with 300wm, 7STW, 7mm Mag and most recently the 6.5x284 and the 6.5 seems to be much easier to shoot, tune and find good loads than the other three rounds, that being said my primary center fire for the past 20+ years is a 6mm-223 AKA (6x45) and if its not windy and shots are under 300 yards its plenty of gun. My 6.5-284, I would not shoot over 500 hundred maybe 600 yards for deer if it was not too brezzy but that's just me
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