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Post by elkman1310 on Jan 8, 2020 17:03:33 GMT -5
There seems to be some confusion on this board what actual long range hunting is. When I hunted in Col. and WY. we did have shots at deer and elk in open high parks or meadows. But those distances were rarely under 1,000 yards. You can run out of gun an glasses very quickly out west. Over the years we kept building better long range guns and glasses so we could make humane extreme long distance kills. The west is no place for a long range muzzleloader no matter how good you think it is.
Here in Pa. we hunt strictly free ranging deer in the mountains with lots of trees and brush. I have seen many so called experienced long range hunters that could not find the deer in the scope at 800 yards and beyond. Now you want to use a muzzleloader which has to be totally removed from the bench and reloaded and then put back on the deer which almost has certainly moved it just doesn't work out that way.
Use the right tools for the job and you can be successful use the wrong ones and you will fail.
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Post by hillbill on Jan 8, 2020 17:36:28 GMT -5
No Carl I don't think there is any confusion? Long range Hunting with the guns we use could be anything over 400 yards? We are not trying to compare what is being done here with what you are doing or have done in the past? What Jeff posted was what CAN happen when the right conditions exist and the correct equipment is used.
Can a SML take a deer at 1000? I say without a doubt. Is it the best tool for the job? That's for the shooter to decide.
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Post by Kyle on Jan 8, 2020 18:32:30 GMT -5
The muzzleloader often may be the only choice available for a particular hunt.
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Post by Hank on Jan 8, 2020 19:18:39 GMT -5
I have been deer hunting (in Kentucky only) for 38 years. I have never once went into the field thinking I might need 2 shots, let alone 20. Out of all the deer I have shot with a rifle only one or two of them required more than one shot, although they were dead with one shot, they ran so I put another one in them. When I head to the field I am 100% sure if I pull the trigger, I will recover my game. I have passed up some really good bucks over the years because they just wouldnt give me the shot I had 100% confidnece in taking. I have never lost a buck while hunting with a gun and only one in my life time when bow hunting. Long range hunting to some is 300 yards, to others it is 1000 yards and to some others it is 2500 yards. What ever distance you choose, you need to practice,(like I did) at that distance and be 100% in your ability and equipment. Take your time judging the yardage, study the wind, and prepare your shot to connect.. Taking a second shot is really not an option for me. I will keep my shots within (what I consider ethical) a realistic distance and go for it. Practice in conditions you expect to hunt in and if those conditions change outside your comfort zone, then just don't take the shot. My rifle is a little different than most muzzle loaders and I have purposly built a place to shoot 1000 yards. I entend on taking a deer at 1000 yards when they cooperate with me and I entend on doing so with one shot. If the wind is blowing to hard or the deer is running or walking to fast I just wont take the shot., but when I do pull the trigger I know I will be loading the deer into the truck, like cord wood. I enjoy reading and learning from everyones experiences and I hope you all can learn from some of my experiences. to each their own,,, I will not judge...............I love you all.
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Post by shindig on Jan 8, 2020 21:22:10 GMT -5
I think that says it all
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Post by hillbill on Jan 9, 2020 5:25:53 GMT -5
Sleeping on this last night my question to you guys is this? What is long range hunting with a Smokeless Muzzleloader???
with a front stuffer you buy over the counter 200 yards is pretty much the limit, some claim 300 yards and so on but the guns we shoot extend that range by what? Double? 400 yards? 600?
My point is what exactly is long range hunting with these guns?
The longest shot I have taken to date is 356 yards, so far I have not had the right opportunity to shoot at one any longer? yes I could have taken a hail Mary shot but I don't operate that way. can I cleanly take an animal past that distance? Yes as long as the conditions are right.
The more time I spend behind these guns the more comfortable I feel about what I consider a LONG SHOT.
IMO long range hunting with a SML in NORMAL field conditions is anything past 300 yards, unless you are shooting prone from bags or a bipod in the field it's very difficult to stay on target in normal field conditions, I have shot out of barns, off hay bales, about everything you can think of.
AM I comfortable taking a shot over 400 Yards? Yes but everything has to be right or I'm not going to pull the trigger.
As Jeff just stated, I intend to haul my deer out after 1 shot and I will not take that shot unless I'm confident I can do so. with the equipment 80 percent of the members here shoot we have enough energy to cleanly kill a deer at 600 yards, some even longer, so what are the thoughts of other members willing to comment?
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Post by outdoors81 on Jan 9, 2020 6:05:13 GMT -5
One shot one kill should be the goal. I can only speak for whitetail hunting. I think the limitations should be on the person pulling the trigger. I feel my effective range right now around 200yds. Before I started shooting out to 200 and 300yds this fall I never knew how much or little wind can make a bullet drift. On my rig a 15mph cross wind will make the bullet drift around 17inches at 300yds. That makes me very gun shy past 200yds until I can figure out the judging the wind piece and my form of pulling to the right at 300yds.
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Post by bkm on Jan 9, 2020 9:51:48 GMT -5
Let’s all be honest and ask ourselves why we have built and hunt with a SML. For the vast majority of us I suspect it is to be able to put bullets down range with better accuracy and more energy to help us harvest the game we’re pursuing. That is a good thing IMO.
What is ELR ? That will vary with each individual. What may be a difficult shot for some may be a chip shot for others. That applies to all aspects of our sport. A 50 yd shot for a bowhunter may seem impossible and unethical to some people but to others it is a high percentage shot and very doable.
Each of us have our limitations. It is up to the individual to learn what those limitations are.
I congratulate Jeff and Kyle for their accomplishment. I know they were prepared to pull it off and their expertise and experience proved it.
Am I jealous? Well, maybe a little 😁
Will I judge? Not Jeff and Kyle for doing something they had planned for and knew they were very capable of. My problem is with those that think just because they did something first or have been doing it longer than the rest of us that somehow that makes them the only ones with the knowledge or ability to instruct everyone else.
If ur reading this chances are ur someone who pushes things to the limit. Whether ur into SML, centerfires, pistols, archery or anything else know ur limits, help those that need ( and will accept ur help) and try not to be so critical of those that have done their homework and surpassed ur abilities.
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Post by Richard on Jan 9, 2020 11:37:43 GMT -5
Good post bkm...................When I tell people I meet in the shooting sports that I have killed antelope and mule deer with my pistol at up to 220 yards, I kind of get that "wary look!" But that is, in fact, the truth? My first LR pistol was a Contender that I had a custom Hart 15" barrel put on and chambered in 7.62 x 39 (yup, the AK-47 round). Prior to heading out to Montana, I had fired some 500+ shots thru that barrel with all types of bullets and loads and from all different positions, both up hill and down hill. I logged all my information (just like you see on my posts) and then developed my "dope" which was taped to the barrel. My rest was a 6-9" Harris swivel bidpod. I had fashioned two Siamese sand bags with tumbling media in them that hung around my neck. I was using a Burris 10X pistol scope. From all my practice, I was confident that any mulie or speed goat that was standing still (or at best slowly grazing) was dead meat. My guide had never guided for a LR pistol shooter and was at best skeptical? Well I proved him wrong with a one shot kill at that distance. The next day he challenged me again on a mule deer at 150 yards and again, one shot was all I needed. The following year, I went with the same outfitter with a different guide and this time a 7/08 XP-100 and a 156 yard "one shot" kill and another speed goat! My point here is the same................You need to do your homework and practice, practice, practice! Hank and Kyle had done just that! I am, however, opposed to hunters that may have a rifle capable of long range shots but are really not "practiced" long range shooters, taking these extended range shots as it is more of a "crap shoot!" for them and unethical! On our first trip out west, the guides were relived to know that my buddy and I were benchrest and ground hog shooters. They complained that a lot of hunters from the east are strictly woods deer hunters and not capable of taking these longer range shots. And that's my take on Long and Extended range hunting!
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